Total Package-the bull

[justme]

Has anyone had any calves out of DeRoucheys bull Total Package?  I've heard some really good reports and am going to look at some this weekend.  He was reccomended to use on some of our cows and haven't heard much about his calves.  Any help would be great!

 

[CAB]

Gidget, I have a cousin that bought into Total Package B4 they syndicated him early. He was dissapointed in the calves, but I never did see any of them. He does aim for club calves when he breeds. He may have some semen that he would sell. I can ask him if you would like me to.

 

[knabe]

i had one that i posted pics on.  i gotta say, he's got excellent pasterns.  best i've seen on a calf that young, though i haven't seen many, but in shows, they are pretty disgusting.  he's gotta ton of meat on him.  he weighed 124 pounds out of my +6bw legacy plus daughter out of a full sis to backdraft, so +6 is probably +15 as she had a 99 lb heifer out of a calving ease bull last year.  i wouldn't say he has a look.  he's got decent bone.  he's also the calf in the pic's with my daughter and dog in the self control thread.  he was a slight pull.  SOLID black, polled.  i think he's (total package) hetero polled (could be wrong on that) supposedly throws white.  the calf 's dripping with muscle over his top.  again, i would call scott rademacher about him as he was an early user.  he can throw some tremendous REA, has some tenderness genes, probably some carcass, as he has thrown some mid range scores on the bovigen panel there.  i also bred him to my midas cow due in the fall.  hoping she has a female or two, she had twins last year.  i would say he's decent between the eyes thickness wise and doesn't have the maine flat head look.  he's definately not a club calf bull in my opinion.  i probably won't bovigen panel test him.  he's definately got the wrinkly neck look, which is thought to be linked to high tenderness markers, ie 4 and above by angus people.  he's straight forward on his feet.  i wouldn't say he's remotely show steery in the way everyone wants them to be with tracking, but he's not base narrow either.  he doesn't look straight topped like paramount, and in my opinion, is a little too growthy, ie high rumped.  he's growing like a weed.  i'd say he's got a decently long stifle and reasonable hip length, slightly tubey, but that's age.  haven't really looked at his front end.  i kinda like him and if he weighed under a hundred, i would have had him tested for markers.  he doesn't have much hair, length wise, i would save average.  i'm probably going to try and get him fat early to take the growth out of him.  he's gonna get eaten as he's sold already.

that said, i am going to use a hetero pattern bulll scott has called SAR he's a lad for second calves on my homo black homo solid heifers.

i wouldn't even remotely use him for club calves, but 3/4 and above females to introgress markers in a decently thick package and then breed them to clubbies.  i'll post some more pics as the calf gets older. 

 

[justme]

Thanks Knabe...I'm looking for a bull to make females to show in pb maines.  I'll call Scott and talk to him.  I've bought a bull off him in the past.  Thanks!

 

[knabe]

somebody else on the planet i think purchased 5 or so females out scott's good bull gvc momentum, which is out daine's icon by ali's sire,NBH POLLED ENERGIZER 688 and a stout female on the bottom.

he's 0 on BW, probably heterozygous for all 3 tenderness genes, just like ali, as they'v both thrown 6 star tenderness females, but also thrown low star individuals, especially ali as he's thrown some single star bulls and heifers.  i think momentum's homoblack, homo solid.  on the top side, you get prospect again, without smithbuilt as well as smithbuilt, so prospect is in there 3 times, twice through smithbuilt.  spattering of the usual suspects everywhere else.  i'd say if you got some soggy females using him, that they would be relatively fixed for that genotypically, if not mated to obviously overly soggy types which people seem to do.  my dream is a soggy line bred smithbuilt/magic type cow extremely close up.  then i would have some fun.  some people are having that fun, and i will play this spring for next year.

 

[common sense]

somebody else on the planet i think purchased 5 or so females out scott's good bull gvc momentum, which is out daine's icon by ali's sire,NBH POLLED ENERGIZER 688 and a stout female on the bottom.

he's 0 on BW, probably heterozygous for all 3 tenderness genes, just like ali, as they'v both thrown 6 star tenderness females, but also thrown low star individuals, especially ali as he's thrown some single star bulls and heifers.  i think momentum's homoblack, homo solid.  on the top side, you get prospect again, without smithbuilt as well as smithbuilt, so prospect is in there 3 times, twice through smithbuilt.  spattering of the usual suspects everywhere else.  i'd say if you got some soggy females using him, that they would be relatively fixed for that genotypically, if not mated to obviously overly soggy types which people seem to do.  my dream is a soggy line bred smithbuilt/magic type cow extremely close up.  then i would have some fun.  some people are having that fun, and i will play this spring for next year.

I think I might be that person...LOL.  We have several daughters out of Momentum.  LOVE THEM!  Momma cows?  You bet your life!  Here's what I love about them.  Longevity--I think I have a couple that could live to be 100.  Sound--(goes along with longevity in my book) Good big foot shape, ample flex to the pasterns and set to the hocks and also have the kind of udders that don't fall apart and milk like crazy.  Feminine- long fronted, angular, big hipped and capacious.  Fertile- just wave the semen in front of them.These females are work horses.  We have put them to the test and used them to raise purebreds out of, doubled them as recips and then used them to raise something out of a club calf bull.  They are the kind of females to build a strong foundation out of so you can breed in other directions.

As for Total Package I would sort of agree with Knabe.  I wouldn't say they are the clubby type but seem to be very breedy.  I have a total package bull calf out of a Draft Pick daughter that is really thick, short on hair, not long on bone BUT soft made, decent ribbed, sound and overall a pretty good bull calf.  Growing very well but not too framey.  I will be anxious to see him in three months.