AI Sires- Dial up BEWARE a BUNCH of pictures

[nysteerguy]

here is a link to reality red if you guys are interested and i've add this pic too:

http://www.topsires.com/bull-pages/RealityRed.html

 

[KDSC]

I added him in to the mix, When I made this thread they still didnt have pictures of RR out there, I think Leroy brown looks the same as in his primmed up photo to his working clothes, and in better condition then some of the others, Thanks a lot nysteerguy

 

[chambero]

The only thing surprising to me about the bull studs is what small of space they appear to house the bulls in.  I would think you could provide a big run for bulls worth that money.

All of those bulls in the photos appear plenty fat.  You ought to see ours about the first of March after they've been running with cows all winter on native grass.  And they still get their job done.

 

[txshowlamb]

i still think they could take better care of them

 

[ruhtram]

are there any other pictures of new bulls?

 

[CAB]

  Reality Red is owned @ least in part by Sulivan's.
  I saw Hard Core this spring. I'd have to see him in the pasture to believe that he is naturally covering cows. That would be an extremely risky venture with his toe!! JMO. Brent

 

[bolt]

Hey that makes me want to pay $300 for heat wave semen. 

 

[mark tenenbaum]

THESE CATTLE ARE NOT BEING CARED FOR PERIOD. NORTH AMERICAN BREEDERS IN BERRYVILLE VA. AND FORMERLY OF MO. COLLECT A MULTITUDE OF WELL KNOWN BULLS, I HAVE SEEN NATIONAL CHAMPIONS FROM ALMOST EVERY BREED THERE. THE ONLY SEMIPERMANENT RESIDENT THAT LOOKS LIKE THAT IS A 10-14 YEAR OLD HOLSTIEN WHO WAS THE BIGGEST DAIRY SEMEN DEAL IN THE WORLD, AND MEAN AS AN IRAC MULLAH.HE HAD 1 HORN, WAS 6FEET OF SKIN AND BONES, AND BASICALLY SAID, IF YOU COME IN THIS PEN,YOUR REAREND IS MINE. O0 ))

 

[olsun]

Just so you all get a true picture, I have been to Hawkeye many times, and have yet to see a bull mistreated. Hardcore looks rough, but that can be blamed on his toe. Heat Wave and all of his clones look the same because they are all unsound, it is only the good care that they have received that has keppt them alive. They would never have made it in a commercial situation. Sunseeker has looked good every time I have seen him. He is sound, but that can't be said for all of his calves. Most of the bulls are only there for short periods of time, and I have yet to see one that isn't treated better than many bulls are treated at home. I believe that Hawkeye has at times been trashed by people who haven't been there. I sure wouldn't be afraid to send them a bull. JMO. Earl

 

[farmboy]

yea they look pretty comfortable to me. thats what they look like after they don't get rinsed 15 times a day and their hair is all matted. they live like kings

 

[bluffcountrycattle]

Just so you all get a true picture, I have been to Hawkeye many times, and have yet to see a bull mistreated. Hardcore looks rough, but that can be blamed on his toe. Heat Wave and all of his clones look the same because they are all unsound, it is only the good care that they have received that has keppt them alive. They would never have made it in a commercial situation. Sunseeker has looked good every time I have seen him. He is sound, but that can't be said for all of his calves. Most of the bulls are only there for short periods of time, and I have yet to see one that isn't treated better than many bulls are treated at home. I believe that Hawkeye has at times been trashed by people who haven't been there. I sure wouldn't be afraid to send them a bull. JMO. Earl

We went through both Nichols and Hawkeye back in May 2009...I thought Sunseeker was the most impressive clubby bred bull, and especially for his age!  Bigger than I thought he would be, sound, and massive.  Don't know a lot about the calves, but the bull himself was very pleasing.  Here is the pic I got...

 

[BCCC]

Must say SS looks great. Way better then most of them, IMO. I think they could probally promote him some more off of a mature photo. Just wondering why did these post come up AFTER breeding time?

 

[bluffcountrycattle]

Must say SS looks great. Way better then most of them, IMO. I think they could probally promote him some more off of a mature photo. Just wondering why did these post come up AFTER breeding time?

I was told prior to going to the studs, that instead of investing in semen after the visit, you would most likely want to swing by the vet clinic and buy Lutylase instead!!!  ;D

 

[justintime]

Sunseeker was the most impressive bull I saw when I toured Hawkeye, over 2 years ago now. Some of the others made me almost gag. I understand that some bulls will lose weight,when they are out breeding cows, but why is it that that many of the high profile bulls I saw appeared to have no natural fleshing ability at all. There were a couple of highly promoted bulls there that after seeing them, I think my cows would stay open if they were the only choices I had to use. Luckily, some got a good picture when they were young as they would split a raindrop on their backs now. Quite frankly, I was a bit shocked at what I saw. ... another life lesson!

 

[farmboy]

sunseeker and milk man.... sunseeker and milk man....

 

[tlcattle]

heres a pic i found of a mature alias.

 

[GONEWEST]

I read through this post and frankly I am amazed at the comments that some better cattlemen than I are making as to how well these bulls are cared for and how they should be looking so much better? Someone mentioned how these bulls led lives like kings. The truth is they live lives like slaves.

First, look at the picture of Sunseeker on the first page and then look at the picture at the top of this page. Doesn't even vaguely resemble the same bull."Massive" sure doesn't apply to that picture.  Maybe because in the first picture he had been in stud for a longer period. These bulls are not fed to gain weight, they are fed at a level to promote semen production. If you have a bull in the pasture breeding cows he needs to be in good shape so he can travel and mount and have libido and all that requires energy. Not true in a bull stud. Amount of semen produced is a different measure than how many cows are bred in the pasture. When we used to take in "problem" donor cows, cows that had not been bred for a long period and would not produce eggs or fertile eggs, without exception those cows were FAT. The overwhelming majority would either breed or produce fertile eggs just by going on a diet and losing alot of weight. They looked really good, but they wouldn't produce. I saw 3C Macho a couple days after he came back from ABS the first time. He looked like he'd been eating snowballs for 6 months. Go see him now out in the pasture and he looks like a butter ball. Has nothing to do with natural fleshing ability. If you starve something, relatively speaking, it WILL lose weight. Look at that picture of poor old Heatwave. If he had no fleshing ability, as it certainly appears in the picture, how is it that he (and his some of his sons) is one of only a handful of clubby bulls that will actually ad body and depth and fleshing ability? And I realize that's not a constant, but consistency and clubby do not belong in the same sentence.


While some are collected by the teaser method, many are collected with an electro-ejaculator? Do you know how that thing was developed? It was originally developed to try to stimulate muscle in soldiers legs who were paralyzed in either WWI or WWII, can't remember form school.  The ejaculation was a side effect. It was found that after time it degenerated nerves in the legs instead of stimulating muscle. It's no wonder these bulls that are collected in that way over a period of time become unsound.

And the conditions these bulls are housed in. Sometimes I'm sick at what my calves live in. According to the pics from REI, mine live in a mansion. I have never been to a stud where it wasn't wet, muddy, uneven, and small. All things that contribute to the unsoundness of a bull no matter his skeletal structure. Many have shade that is only over concrete. It is really hard for me to believe that aspca hasn't been all over some of these people. They may not be intentionally mistreated but they are certainly housed in conditions and cared for in ways that are not conducive to long life and good health of a mature bull. I am sure that there are bull studs that have better facilities than others. I've seen pictures, just never been there.

My point is, I don't think that you'd be so surprised at how unsound and how bad these bulls appear if you were more familiar with how they are handled and managed at MOST facilities. Maybe you have experiences with better facilities or different management. But it is not the norm. Or maybe you think that a bull should look like his show pictures after being housed in a small, wet, muddy, uneven, pen with concrete in 1/3 of it, being fed rough hay and a little feed. Some of these bulls would eat 100 lbs of grain a day. Maybe you think 20 should be enough to keep them fit. Mayeb as someone said they are treated better than some are treated at home. If that's the case, those bulls have poor homes and I feel sorry for them.

I would say, "it's just my opinion." But it's not an opinion,  it's just my experience.

 

[chambero]

According to the pics from REI, .....

Did you really mean REI (the facility in Stillwater) or did you mean Hawkeye where most of these pictures were apparently taken.  We took a bull up to REI in Stillwater last year to get collected and I was very apprehensive because of the photos I'd seen on here of other facilities.  The REI facilities were super nice, and even though it was dry there, looked like their pens would drain well and not get unreasonably muddy.  The bulls were not kept on concrete.  All the bulls there were in what I call good shape - not too fat but not pulled down really hard either.  Like you'd expect a bull to be in the pasture.  Our Angus bull (who had been on nothing but good grass) was considered too fat when they got him.  He spent almost 60 days there and came back a little leaner, but not too skinny.

Heat Wave was probably pulled down on purpose to get some weight off those legs.  A crippled bull is going to get skinny any way - no matter how hard you feed them.

 

[chambero]

Never mind, just saw the post on bulls at REI.  The photos don't do their facilities justice though.  I thought they were very nice facilities and served their purpose to keep bulls in sanitary conditions and safe.

 

[lowann]

blue blood is lookin good, anyone seen any calves yet?

We have a blue roan heifer, and a red steer out of  Blue Blood. I want to keep the heifer. She isn't anything show quality, but I think she will make an awsome cow. The red steer will be sold at our local club calf sale. Lots of bone on both of them.