Bull or steer him

[DLB]

Had an older post-cant find it.  He's a Jake's Proud Jazz x Ali/Power Plus maine heifer.  bW 76lbs.  DOB was 1/27/14

 

[mark tenenbaum]

If he ll grow and if hes clean-BULL-there needs to be some more Blues available-and hes got some real good Maines etc-along with Jazz:Hed work on alot of different cattle-Simms come to mind immediately-along with various clubby types O0

 

[DLB]

Mark-
He is THF/PHAF by pedigree.  He has grown pretty well.  He's about 4 1/2months old.  On momma and pasture-no creep.  The pic is of him nursing momma-and she's no dink.

 

[OH Breeder]

Mark-
He is THF/PHAF by pedigree. 

DS? Jazz

 

[RyanChandler]

Between myself and my good friend, we've prolly had 200 calves born out of jpj sons and zero have had any rear leg mobility issues-- many of which have been double breds out of jpj daughters and granddaughters.  I'm becoming more speculative by the day as to the motives of the individuals pushing the issue.

That calf is a rip!  I wouldn't use a crossbred bull but the calf is surely a testament to the quality genetics your operating w/. 

 

[OH Breeder]

Between myself and my good friend, we've prolly had 200 calves born out of jpj sons and zero have had any rear leg mobility issues-- many of which have been double breds out of jpj daughters and granddaughters.  I'm becoming more speculative by the day as to the motives of the individuals pushing the issue.

That calf is a rip!  I wouldn't use a crossbred bull but the calf is surely a testament to the quality genetics your operating w/.

FIRST- Nice calf do not want to side track your thread. Always like a blue roan. Demonstrates several characteristics that are appealing.

Motives of?

Out of my GIANT herd of 15 cows I had 4 calves total. 4/15= 27% calf crop affected. OR take 60 of your 200 calves and throw them behind the barn. Hope they get up nurse and spend additional time making sure they can stand and move to eat. Then the ones that can move do not perform and as AJ posted here they usually are dinks.

Two PHC possiblely cows which one was suppose to be free. The other a 17 year old cow that had never had a defect an til this mating.
One THC cow with a club sire that went back to a shorthorn sire who has now been tested
One Shorthorn cow THF and PHF with Double Stuff and Improver in her back ground.
Two completely immobile and one with one leg affected, one aborted at 7 months badly twisted and would not have moved much at all. None of these females are in my herd as well as the bull have been eliminated.
Same stories occurred with with TH an til it became more prevelant.

 

[mark tenenbaum]

Hes talking about JPJ sons-which puts another generation in the mix-At this juncture-one of the 3 most structurally correct bulls Ive ever seen is a barn find in Iowa-clean NON-Dink: Starburst out of a Sin CityxDouble Vision. All I have are terrible cell pics-and I hate to post them because they just dont show what this calf is,I will however,use him,and have sent pics to some of my buddies who are going to try him too.Any body who wants to see him can PM me thier e-mail-getting collected in Iowa:I sure would use him on the dam of this very cool blue roan-HES WHITE O0

 

[RyanChandler]

I don't know what to tell you..  We've had a relatively large sample size and like I said, zero occurrences.  There has to be more to it.  Of course I believe you're account but how is it that some are being plagued w/ it and others haven't seen it at all?  JSF likely has had more jpj pedigreed calves born there than anyone.  If this was something that is solely related to JPJ---- and not something to do w/ other genetics or a combination of genetics, I would think the affliction would be highly prevalent in his calf crop.   

JPJ has the highest number of registered calves of any SH sire ever-- (I believe)--  the potential motives for those who haven't incorporated his influence to smear the pedigrees of those who have is endless.

 

[mark tenenbaum]

Thats a very good point-the incorporated genetics would have to play a part-Im betting Jungles doesnt have many pha carriers in his herd-or clubby (Improver-Stinger based?) genetics that would lend themselves to these kind of afflictions. O0

 

[LLBUX]

I like the calf, but question the value of a low% Short plus as a herd bull.

Could you register calves out of him?

That would limit further his use as a sire if you can produce crossbred calves only(unless out of other breed registered dams)

I would cut him soon and offer him as a Shorthorn Plus steer. 

Good luck-

 

[oakview]

Eventually, (I hope!) the DS carrier list will be made public and the ASA's method of handling it will be adopted.  Those of us who have either had calves afflicted with DS or know of others that have know where it came from.  I've got to believe it will become public knowledge.  Until that time, my policy is to avoid any purchase of suspected bloodlines unless they are tested first.  That includes TH, PHA, and DS.  As a good friend of mine in Kansas found out, a DSC bull can spread the problem very quickly.  So far, 7 of the 10 he has tested have come back DSC.  Two others, no reason to test them, were physically deformed.

There might be good news, though.  On the Fox News home page, there is a photo of a Char X calf that had been fitted with prosthetic legs.  Finally, a solution to the age old quandry of just what to do with those problem DS and TH calves.  Just take them to Texas where they can be fitted with bionic limbs!  Then we can debate whether judges should discount artificial legs in the showring.  I've got to wonder how to grow hair on them, though.

 

[DLB]

If I keep the calf a bull, I would likely register him as a maintainer (mom is a PB maine).  Which in turn would mean the offspring would be eligible too. 

 

[mark tenenbaum]

If I keep the calf a bull, I would likely register him as a maintainer (mom is a PB maine).  Which in turn would mean the offspring would be eligible too. ///HE COULD be both-Young Money is a plus-and gets used alot on horns and other cattle-the whole point of proving any breed is how they cross-show and otherwise-The so-called purebred shorts arent any more pure than black:simms,Gelvighs,Limmies,Herefords,even some Charolais-so cutting him cuz hes a blue is stupid on a calf that good,with the kind of maternal stout maine dam he has,and the calving ease in most of his pedigree-Ill take a 1/2 to 3/4 out of one like him over the popular trump deals any day-along with the color-because I dont see many new deals that are functional that arent solid red,and go back to either the Hartman Countess-and or Red Advantager some of the other non-maine low bw deals-and although this is a NEEEDED improvement-LOOK at that easy keeping cow hes out of-how many Trump Yatta Yatta Shorthorns;or frail looking maternal shorthorns look like that?. O0

 

[DLB]

Recent pics

 

[DLB]

Here is another

 

[Tallcool1]

Steer.

Register him Maintainer and Shorthorn Plus.  He is way cool as a steer.  Look at that front end!

 

[DLB]

I think he would be a decent steer.  Sound, plenty of meat and he has pretty nice hair for Soutb Texas and our 95+degree weather.

 

[DLB]

This fella is for sale.  Decided not to keep him....his dam and granddam are 2 of my main females...so a lot of my herd is closely related.  I know there is a classified section...for some reason it won't let me upload my pics/ad there.  Any questions message me.