calves out of clones

[HerefordGuy]

What are peoples opinions about calves out of the original bull and calves out of his clones?

 

[HerefordGuy]

People are either not very interested in this topic, or trepidacious to answer. 
From my understanding of cloning, the only difference between the two animal's genome should be the mitochondial DNA that was in the egg used to make the clone.  Bulls do not pass on their mitocondria to their offspring, so clones and the original bulls should on average pass on the same genetic merit to the calves.  I would say there is no more difference between calves our of a clone compared to differences between calves out of the original.   

 

[knabe]

this topic has been covered rather deeply.  there are lots of reasons clones won't be the same other than mitochodrial dna.  do a search on this site.

whether these differences translate into something people can visualize is where opinion comes in.

why don't you set up a blind comparison?

the smart little lena clones don't look the same.

 

[HerefordGuy]

The post does not discuss clones being the same (clones are different due to methylation status, mtDNA and other factors).  The topic is the progeny of clones being similar.  Do you know of research that shows progeny of clones are statistically different? That would be a very interesting paper.

At the University of Missouri, they have produced transgenic pigs using nuclear transfer (the same process as most clones).  The transgenic clones can look very weird and have lots of problems (probably due to DNA methylation) but the progeny of these clones look like normal pigs (other than the transgene).

 

[knabe]

The post does not discuss clones being the same (clones are different due to methylation status, mtDNA and other factors).  The topic is the progeny of clones being similar.  Do you know of research that shows progeny of clones are statistically different? No.  look using mice or some other model organism probably. That would be a very interesting paper.

At the University of Missouri, they have produced transgenic pigs using nuclear transfer (the same process as most clones).  The transgenic clones can look very weird and have lots of problems (probably due to DNA methylation) but the progeny of these clones look like normal pigs (other than the transgene).



here's something that has always worried me about clones and would add to testing costs of using clones, unless of course one wasn't worried about keeping the progeny from a clone around very long. 

http://www3.interscience.wiley.com/journal/111089273/abstract?CRETRY=1&SRETRY=0

i guess it's fair to say the jury is still out on clones.

 

[shortyjock89]

What about progeny of bulls that were cloned from steers?  

What about longevity of progeny of clones vs. longevity of the clones themselves?  

 

[TJ]

Cloning gone wrong?    ???

 

[shortyjock89]

Was that picture taken in the West End TJ?  (lol)

 

[HerefordGuy]

I like the pic!!!

 

[HerefordGuy]

The post does not discuss clones being the same (clones are different due to methylation status, mtDNA and other factors).  The topic is the progeny of clones being similar.  Do you know of research that shows progeny of clones are statistically different? No.  look using mice or some other model organism probably. That would be a very interesting paper.

At the University of Missouri, they have produced transgenic pigs using nuclear transfer (the same process as most clones).  The transgenic clones can look very weird and have lots of problems (probably due to DNA methylation) but the progeny of these clones look like normal pigs (other than the transgene).



here's something that has always worried me about clones and would add to testing costs of using clones, unless of course one wasn't worried about keeping the progeny from a clone around very long. 

http://www3.interscience.wiley.com/journal/111089273/abstract?CRETRY=1&SRETRY=0

i guess it's fair to say the jury is still out on clones.

What is the title and authors of the paper you posted the link for?  The link didn't work for me. ???

 

[TJ]

Was that picture taken in the West End TJ?  (lol)

If that clone has been tattooed, it might be Lennie after a wild night, out doing the Shawneetown stomp, at Hog Daddy's. 

 

[knabe]

What is the title and authors of the paper you posted the link for?  The link didn't work for me. ???

Telomere length analysis in goat clones and their offspring
Dean H. Betts 1 *, Steven D. Perrault 1, Jim Petrik 1, Lucy Lin 1, Laura A. Favetta 1, Carol L. Keefer 2, W. Allan King 1

just google telomere length clones progeny offspring etc.

 

[HerefordGuy]

What is the title and authors of the paper you posted the link for?  The link didn't work for me. ???

Telomere length analysis in goat clones and their offspring
Dean H. Betts 1 *, Steven D. Perrault 1, Jim Petrik 1, Lucy Lin 1, Laura A. Favetta 1, Carol L. Keefer 2, W. Allan King 1

just google telomere length clones progeny offspring etc.

Thanks! 

 

[LinZ]

We have a bred heifer out of a clone of Powerdrive and she looks very much likes other Powerdrive offspring.

LinZ

 

[Show Steaks]

When they clone buills they can only clone "genoe type" not "pheno type"

 

[HerefordGuy]

When they clone buills they can only clone "genoe type" not "pheno type"

Correct, and the only thing that can be passed on to offspring is genotype.  The nuclear DNA genotype of the original and cloned bulls are identical, thus the average performance (for example YW) is going to be statistically the same for the progeny of both the original bull and the clone.  In other words, the expected progeny difference (EPD) for the two bulls will be the same. 

This is theoretically what should happen.  If there are differences there are some interesting and complicated processes occuring.  :-\

 

[CJC]

Cloning gone wrong?    ???

(lol) (lol) (clapping) (clapping)