County-bred restricted shows?

[Open to the World]

I was just wondering......have any of you encountered county fairs where they restrict where you are allowed to purchase your steer calf from?  Is this common in places other than Florida?  What happened to a free ecomony and the right to go out and select the genetics that you want to use?  How is this sort of thing educational to students??

 

[AAOK]

Our County Steer show has been closed to only County Bred and Born for over 60 years.  Everything else is open, but the Steer Show will never change.  Ours is an area of approx 40K with 3/8 living in the largest community and 5/8 rural.  We have 6 school systems, with the "City" accounting for 3/8 of the Student population.  They have no Ag Progran, so most livingwith in the City limits have no idea Livestock Shows exist.  The biggest goal in our Steer Show is to win the Rate of Gain.  This causes most steers to be Fat, and never worked so as to not disturb their appetite.  The overall winner is the lowest score combinig Rate of Gain and On-hoof placement; also the first animal in the "Sale".  This is just one of the reasons we chose to show Heifers.

 

[OLD WORLD SHORTIE]

Yea i dont like the sound of that at all. But i guess it helps local producers of cattle. As a hardcore freemarket economist , as long as it was made here in America is usually my rule. But now its as long as it was made in this county. I still have some issues with restricting the basic human right of preference in a so called free market economy. Is this not America?

 

[mrs sawboss]

I have a cousin who lives in NW Houston (Cypress) and they draw lots and pick their steers from a group of steers that the ag teachers purchase.  Number 1 gets first pick, etc.  There is a fee but I don't know what they pay to participate.  I believe it is a school district only show with 6 or 7 high schools in their district.  No outside steer purchases are allowed to participate in the show.

 

[Open to the World]

That is very similar to what I'm talking about.  Except ag teachers dont pick the steers.....the calves are brouht in from local ranches, and students draw a number, pick their calf in that order, and pay a flat rate for each calf.  I personally think it is a horrible idea, and for a lot of reasons.  I'm just curious what everyone thinks of this sort of show. 

For example..one concern I have is for students who raise their own steers.  The student and their families take the initiate to purchase a few females, and they AI, and build their own little operation, and show a steer calf they raise themselves.  Isn't that the ultimate educational situation?  A show like this completely takes away from such an opportunity.

 

[jjkchast]

I was just wondering......have any of you encountered county fairs where they restrict where you are allowed to purchase your steer calf from?  Is this common in places other than Florida?  What happened to a free ecomony and the right to go out and select the genetics that you want to use?  How is this sort of thing educational to students??

I believe this is a lawsuit waiting to happen, This is a business and also an industry within itself, and in Corp america when you prohibit free trade and exclude competition it is a direct violation of the law. I can not believe no one has not done something about this earlier. As a farmer this would be no different than taking my grain to market only to find out I either can not sell it or get 1/2 of what someone else gets because their zip code is different.

 

[herfchic]

A county here in IL has a seperate county-bred class.  If the animal was bred/born in the county it can show in that class, and it doesn't matter if the owner lives in the county or not.  I won it last year with a Hereford;  it paid really well, and there seemed to be a lot of support from the breeders in the county.  I think there were about 10 heifers in the class. 

 

[Open to the World]

At one time, that is what our county did.  Steers entered in our fair could come from anywhere, but there was a seperate class/show for steers bred in our county, and our local cattlemen's assocation paid an extra premium to those steers.  I think it was a great idea, but to make everyone follow that guideline, I believe is wrong.

To the other post - I completely agree.  This is a business, and an industry, and it just plain isn't right.

 

[GoWyo]

I was just wondering......have any of you encountered county fairs where they restrict where you are allowed to purchase your steer calf from?  Is this common in places other than Florida?  What happened to a free ecomony and the right to go out and select the genetics that you want to use?  How is this sort of thing educational to students??

I believe this is a lawsuit waiting to happen, This is a business and also an industry within itself, and in Corp america when you prohibit free trade and exclude competition it is a direct violation of the law. I can not believe no one has not done something about this earlier. As a farmer this would be no different than taking my grain to market only to find out I either can not sell it or get 1/2 of what someone else gets because their zip code is different.

I don't see any lawsuit waiting to happen in this situation.  If this is a show rule, then that is the way it is.  Go find or raise the best steer in the county.  Every show has different rules.  I do favor the incentive of a separate class with nice awards for county bred and fed rather than restricting the whole show, but every show has its rules.

 

[farmin female]

I also agree that its not right when you have no options.  Our county sometimes has a county bred steer show. We don't have a lot of producers in the area so most years it doesn't happen.  But, our state fair has a state bred steer show.  That show is restricted to calves born and bred in the state.  Yes, they have restrictions even on AI'd calves.  But several people have worked hard to promote the state bred show and, in doing so, they managed to build a nice payout if you win - and even place.  It has become a competitve show and has no bearing on the regular steer show.  They even hire a seperate judge for it.  You can show your calf in both shows since the state bred show only pays out in winnings and has no bearing on the sale order.      

 

[Open to the World]

I was just wondering......have any of you encountered county fairs where they restrict where you are allowed to purchase your steer calf from?  Is this common in places other than Florida?  What happened to a free ecomony and the right to go out and select the genetics that you want to use?  How is this sort of thing educational to students??

I believe this is a lawsuit waiting to happen, This is a business and also an industry within itself, and in Corp america when you prohibit free trade and exclude competition it is a direct violation of the law. I can not believe no one has not done something about this earlier. As a farmer this would be no different than taking my grain to market only to find out I either can not sell it or get 1/2 of what someone else gets because their zip code is different.

I don't see any lawsuit waiting to happen in this situation.  If this is a show rule, then that is the way it is.  Go find or raise the best steer in the county.  Every show has different rules.  I do favor the incentive of a separate class with nice awards for county bred and fed rather than restricting the whole show, but every show has its rules.

The problem is that you cant go out and select the best steer in the county....only a select handful of producers are allowed to put calves int o the sale, and then you have to draw a number to select a calf.  If there are 40 exhibitors and you draw number 40, then 39 people ahead of you chose first and you are stuck with what is left.  It isnt very fare.....not to the exhibitors, and not to breeders either.

 

[Open to the World]

I also agree that its not right when you have no options.  Our county sometimes has a county bred steer show. We don't have a lot of producers in the area so most years it doesn't happen.  But, our state fair has a state bred steer show.  That show is restricted to calves born and bred in the state.  Yes, they have restrictions even on AI'd calves.  But several people have worked hard to promote the state bred show and, in doing so, they managed to build a nice payout if you win - and even place.  It has become a competitve show and has no bearing on the regular steer show.  They even hire a seperate judge for it.  You can show your calf in both shows since the state bred show only pays out in winnings and has no bearing on the sale order.      

I agree totally.  Have a seperate show for those who want to do it, and for those specific supporters.  In all honesty, it is done to control who wins. 

 

[vc]

From what you are saying it is more than just bred and born in the county, since you are only allowed to by from the sale and only certain farms are allowed to supply calves they are trying to make your show. All the calves are probably sorted so they are as close to type and kind as they can get, this makes it so everyone is on a level playing field, no one has an advantage, and if they are all fed the same they will all look alike at the show. Wow what a blast that would be to watch. (sarcasm)

They probably decided to do this to stop the complaining, we have seen it here on this forum and on others: Well so and so family always goes out and buys expensive calves, this family spend to much money, it is political, The judge bred that calf or something along those lines. This is the only way they could find to take all the complaining out of the competition.

My question is what are they going to use for criteria, ADG, Carcass Yield & grade, Class placing, A commercial guys that is doing his job right will have uniform calves that all look alike. You are basically having a feeding competition, with some husbandry and showmanship thrown in.

We have a Bred and Fed class but it is a separate class that calves bred and fed in the county can enter (these same animals show in the regular classes as well) winner gets 500 premium, second gets 300, third gets 200 4Th a 100 and 5th is like 50. Rules are loose if at best, no blood test, just the breeders word.

 

[jjkchast]

My issue is it prevents "Free Trade" and artificially creates value for some verses others. If you are a producer in that county you will be able to charge more for your animals verses a producer in a neighboring county whos cattle can not be shown in that show. Like it or not it could possibly be a legal action if someone wanted to push the issue because it is preventing some producers from being able to market thier product "cattle" to a group of individuals, or in a specific marketing area. It would be no different than if a county or city only allowed GM cars to be sold and didnt allow Ford or Dodge to market in the same area. Do you not think this would be a lawsuit.

 

[SFASUshowman]

I have seen a lot of counties that have special classes for county raised animals, and some just show them with everything else and reward the highest placing county bred animal.  I grew up in Louisiana and most of the Parish Shows and all of the district and State Shows gave awards and premiums for the high placing Louisiana Bred animals.
As far as the school district show in Houston, that is fairly common here in TX, especially with the Ag Programs in the cities and suburbs.  It is really common for the schools here to have Ag Barns, and most of those calves are raised in those barns and never go home.  The purpose behind this is educational and providing the kids with the opportunity to have a livestock project.  In those settings most of the kids have no place to raise an animal, have no experience with animals, and it is all to intimidating to their parents to go out and try to find a calf, pig, lamb, or goat.  So the Ag Teachers go out and purchase a group of animals, ussually steers or pigs, they keep the cost down so that they can charge a nominal fee for the kids to participate. 
I dont know how all of them do it, but I know one school district that does it with hogs, the kids sign up and I think they pay $100.  They have to sign up before the Ag Teacher goes to buy.  So if he has 25 students sign up he knows he has $2500 to spend.  He typically goes to show pig producers and picks their lower end and sometimes to Duncan and buys pigs out of the parking lot.  He naturally spends an average of $100 per pig, and does his absolute best to get pigs that are fairly similar in conformation at that point.  Then the kids draw numbers and pick their pig in the order they drew.  The pigs are tagged before the draw.  The students can take the animal home if they have a suitable place to raise it, or they can raise it at the schools Ag Barn(which most do).  The Ag Teacher helps when needed but it is the students and their families responsibility to choose what to feed, purchase the feed, and feed the animal.  At the end they have a show, and with the similarity in the animals at the beginning it really comes down to how good of a job the student did raising and preparing the animal.  I personally think this is a great opportunity for students to learn.  I Have even known of some instances where it lead to the students parents purchasing them projects for future county shows and even majors.  I think in that siutaiont it provid3s a great opportunity for students who may not otherwise have it

 

[aggiegal]

Quite a few counties in East Texas have the county bred only rule.  I don't think it is as uncommon as some might think..even in TX.

 

[Gators Rule]

Yea i dont like the sound of that at all. But if guss it helps local producers of cattle. As a hardcore freemarket economist , as long as it was made here in America is usually my rule. But now its as long as it was made in this county. I still have some issues with restricting the basic human right of preference.

I guess it really depends on who is supporting the kids when the animals sell.  Here in my county of 27,000, there is only one high school, and the fair auction is probably 75% supported by the ranchers in our county.  I really don't see it as a problem because of the support they give on the front end as well as the backend.  With that said, the caliber of steers is outstanding, and they could compete at any county fair in Florida. 

My home county (Polk) has no restrictions on the origination of the steers.  The only county bred class is average daily gain, and it is a big dollar prize.

 

[OH Breeder]

One day in our county is decaded to Born and Raised Steer Show. We show by shoulder height. Then we have the Junior Fair Steer show the following day also by shoulder height. Never had any problems. Both are pretty competative.
I would say you lobby your fair board for an open show and a county show. See if there is enough interest in your county to change and allow this option. As with any thing most folks DON"T like change. But if you see a need why not get out and work with the fair board to see what you inspire.

 

[Open to the World]

I guess it really depends on who is supporting the kids when the animals sell.   Here in my county of 27,000, there is only one high school, and the fair auction is probably 75% supported by the ranchers in our county.   I really don't see it as a problem because of the support they give on the front end as well as the backend.   With that said, the caliber of steers is outstanding, and they could compete at any county fair in Florida.   

My home county (Polk) has no restrictions on the origination of the steers.   The only county bred class is average daily gain, and it is a big dollar prize.
[/quote]

I dont know if you've heard about the rumors, but I believe Polk is moving towards this system....county bred and drawn from a lottery style like the state fair.  I believe it will be taking away from the educational value of the show.

 

[cjcranor1806]

I dont know if you've heard about the rumors, but I believe Polk is moving towards this system....county bred and drawn from a lottery style like the state fair.  I believe it will be taking away from the educational value of the show.
[/quote]

If polk county goes to where you can only purchase steers is polk county it could be a good thing. But  I think they will lose more kids showing if they go to a lottery style system like the state fair.