Eat'm or Breed'm

[Clark Club Calves]

I have twin Monopoly X Who Made Who heifers.  They are a lot smaller than our regular Maine heifers. As calves they had hair like a highlander and are very correct.  Their mother is one of our smallest cows and I am wondering if they are just getting too small to be beef producing cows that will produce the odd club calf.  I would AI them to a really easy calving Angus bull that we have used before with birth weights around 55 to 70 lbs.  Are they worth keeping as cows?  SP is never short of opinion so let me hear them.

 

[BCCC]

How old are they? How much do they weigh?

 

[Clark Club Calves]

They are just over a year old born in May of 2008. Weight  I would say 600 to 700 lbs

 

[TMJ Show Cattle]

Do you breed for spring borns or fall borns? I think they may just be a little late maturing,but they look heavier in the pictures than 700-800lbs. Hard to say.Alot of club calf momma's that produce the "great' calves are much smaller than most folks realize.If you think they are of good quality and don't NEED to sell them,breed them at 18 or 19 months if they have grown or matured to your satisfaction and see what happens.I would use total Solution or Ali or one of his sons instead of an Angus on them when it comes time,if that time comes.My god ,I can't believe I'm saying this but there are some Lowline breeders on here that could direct you in a good direction if they fail to mature in to what you think they should be. That might be an interesting combination.

 

[Cattledog]

Do you breed for spring borns or fall borns? I think they may just be a little late maturing,but they look heavier in the pictures than 700-800lbs. Hard to say.Alot of club calf momma's that produce the "great' calves are much smaller than most folks realize.If you think they are of good quality and don't NEED to sell them,breed them at 18 or 19 months if they have grown or matured to your satisfaction and see what happens.I would use total Solution or Ali or one of his sons instead of an Angus on them when it comes time,if that time comes.My god ,I can't believe I'm saying this but there are some Lowline breeders on here that could direct you in a good direction if they fail to mature in to what you think they should be. That might be an interesting combination.

I agree.  TJ may have some suggestions for you.  Although I don't raise lowlines myself, I have asked him quite a few questions about the breed.  He is very knowledgeable about how to use the lowline breed to your advantage.

 

[jbzdad]

I think heifers grow a lot even after their first calf, I would keep em, they are plenty thick, with good rib... I would try to keep on schedule so would go ahead and AI in next month for may calves
.. we use OCC HOmer with good vigorous small calves ... then I would get them weaned back off as soon as possible ... the hardest thing will be getting them bred back on time after their first calf.... good luck

 

[linnettejane]

if they were mine,id wait til they were 2 (try to get as much grow out of them as you can) and  breed your low birthweight angus or gigolo joe for first calves...then second go around id hit them with a lbw shorty......

or the 18-19 months with a lowline sounds interesting too! 

 

[brandisshortys]

Whenever we have a heifer that is a little small, we have our veterinarian roughly measure her pelvis and tract to make sure she can handle having her first calf before we breed her.  Sometimes some of the really small framed heifers can surprise you.  They can possible have a much bigger pelvis than you think.  After that first calf is born, they're pelvises usually expand quite a bit.

 

[LN]

I think the heifers weigh more than 700 lbs too. If you could get an actual weight on them it would help you gauge where they are. I think they look like good, functional heifers. If they are slower maturing, I would breed them at  20 months if you have two calving seasons.

 

[HerefordGuy]

I agree with brandisshortys, I would get their pelvis areas measured.  That way you can make a more informed decision and possibly save yourself from a train wreck down the road.

 

[Reinken Cattle Co.]

Send them my way ill breed them to my lowline bull  ;D calving ease at its best. But in all reality if your thinking about eating them?! get ahold of me ill throw them in my herd.


Matt

 

[OH Breeder]

I think your heifers are right on track. They may be more moderate in size but some of the best club calf momma's are small framed cows. I like them. Breed them easy the first go around. Northern Improvment would be my choice for them.

 

[justintime]

By all means, breed these heifers, as I think there is a lot of good in both of them. They are heifers that you can go a lot of different ways with. I would use an easy calving sire for the first calf, and once they have calved , then start looking at clubbie bulls to use on them. They look feminine and fertile, have good capacity and are pretty sound made. It is worth giving them a shot, unless you have more heifers of better quality that you want to retain.

 

[doublestuff]

I'd keep them

 

[TMJ Show Cattle]

All of the above are good suggestions. There is one point I would like to make though.For years people have said there is NO club calf bull that can be called calving ease. I beg to differ on that statement. After 4 years of using TOTAL SOLUTION on first calf heifers and mature cows,we and others in our neck of the woods have never had a calf weigh over 75lbs. Most of his calves,no matter what they are out of, weigh approx. from 58 to 65lbs. The notion that you absolutely must use an Angus on first calf heifers is wrong. Northern Improvement calves for us have constantly outweighed Total Solution calves on first calf heifers.Why is this? I have no clue,I just know the facts for us. The Total Solution calves as a whole are vigorous,hairy,and show way more muscle expression at weaning time. Several of them have won tough county,state,and have fared very well at the Texas and Oklahoma majors.They work slick or with hair.We have kept several heifers for replacements and they make wonderful cows.

 

[bjs]

heck yess keep em......they should raise killer steers

 

[OH Breeder]

All of the above are good suggestions. There is one point I would like to make though.For years people have said there is NO club calf bull that can be called calving ease. I beg to differ on that statement. After 4 years of using TOTAL SOLUTION on first calf heifers and mature cows,we and others in our neck of the woods have never had a calf weigh over 75lbs. Most of his calves,no matter what they are out of, weigh approx. from 58 to 65lbs. The notion that you absolutely must use an Angus on first calf heifers is wrong. Northern Improvement calves for us have constantly outweighed Total Solution calves on first calf heifers.Why is this? I have no clue,I just know the facts for us. The Total Solution calves as a whole are vigorous,hairy,and show way more muscle expression at weaning time. Several of them have won tough county,state,and have fared very well at the Texas and Oklahoma majors.They work slick or with hair.We have kept several heifers for replacements and they make wonderful cows.

By using Total Solution on these heifers that would be line breeding Who made Who. that could be really good or really bad. Everyone has a calving ease bull that consistently works for them. We have used Northern Improvement, Gizmo - which would also be a good choice with these ladies, Jake's Proud Jazz and SS Traveler 510. You could get some cool Shortohrn Plus calves from Gizmo. My point, USE something that is proven calving ease. These were twins and may have had larger birthweights had they been singles. I still think when you breed XX to XX you get more variability.

 

[mark tenenbaum]

THOSE HIEFERS ARE PLENTY BIG ENOUGH TO HAVE LATER CALVES, THERE ARE ALOT OF STRUGGLING FIRST CALVERS IN ARRID AREAS THAT CALVE AT THAT WIEGHT BECAUSE THEY ARE THIN, AND THOSE 2 ARE OBVIOUSLY IN GOOD ORDER.I THINK A SHORTHORN IN THIS CASE, WOULD REALLY COMPLEMENT THEM THE WAY THEY ARE MADE O0

 

[dori36]

Send them my way ill breed them to my lowline bull  ;D calving ease at its best. But in all reality if your thinking about eating them?! get ahold of me ill throw them in my herd.


Matt

Let me chime in on Matt's note.  I really like the heifers and if you want to be sure on the first calf, you 'could' use a Lowline.  Nancy, of Lazy G Lowlines, has a dynamite red bull (Bluey) who would be a "marriage made in heaven" for the heifers.  There are Lowline breeders out there who would probably love to have good females like these to breed for red percentage Lowlines, which are becoming more valuable and sought after!  I guess after all that, I think I'd keep 'em and either breed them at 13 - 15 months to a Lowline, or wait a few more months and breed them to the Angus bull you've mentioned. If I was still running cattle, I'd try to talk you out the them! Luck!!