Ft. Worth steer show

[herf96]

I seriously doubt that the AHA will promote the winning of a hereford steer.  A few years back a hereford was picked as reserve in Houston, not  a word said about the champion at Houston from the association.  They are to afraid to promote their own breed.  Angus is kicking the AHA teeth in when it comes to marketing, it isnt even close.  That is one of the biggest reason for our own purebred dispersal.  The hereford deal is very disappointing when it comes to pormotion of their own.  I was in attendance for the show and the hereford that is res. grand was very functional and very consistent in the way that the judge likes them.  I thought it was a good show, not everyone will agree with it but he was consistent in picking functional cattle that were not in the extremes of any in terms of phenotype.  I do not believe that the hereford steers wins that breed every year, but he was a dang sure a good one fit by some of the best, and fits that particular judge very well. 

As far as fixiing the classification deal, that is a hard question.  DNA will not work, I promise some associations do not want to open that can of worms.  I have personally talked with one association about this matter.  I really like the way that the hereford and shorthorn committees are handling classification.  The angus deal is always tough.  Some people have it figured out, I guess if i was in on that deal I would study my lesson and watch the repeat winners in that deal.

 

[carl s.]

They are to afraid to promote their own breed.

I thought we were taking about Hereford.  What does the Chianina association have to do with it?

 

[BIGTEX]

I heard the Grand steer got 3rd in his class at his county show. Any truth?

 

[chambero]

I dont know, but wouldnt doubt it.  She's from a real tough county.

 

[cookcattleco]

Who raised the grand steer or where did he come from anybody know?

 

[mp]

Justin Renfro sold the calf. Talked to some people that looked at him when he was for sale and passed on him, they were kicking themselves saturday on sale day. They said he had just been banded when they saw him and he didnt look that good. He wasnt a freak by any means and probably not a great one, but you couldnt pick a hole in him. He was sound, functional, problem free and easy doing. Hard to argue with the decision although I liked the shorthorn, but I might be a little partial!

 

[simtal]

The hereford marked Dr. Hook.

So the Hereford was a Showtime X Dr. Hook? 
I think the AHA should promote it.  As I've said before, if every other breed is crossed up at Ft. Worth, what's wrong with the Hereford being crossed?
If you've watched Hereford advertisements, most of the time they have a big picture of a black baldy front and center.

I bet the hereford assoc wants to stay clear of the club calf world, especially from a registery that is not open

 

[herf96]

The AHA would be crazy not to promote a this res. grand.  He is out of registered bull, but I promise you it will be up to the owner of the bull to promote this well deserved accomplishment. 

 

[afhm]

Who raised the grand steer or where did he come from anybody know?

Derek Poe raised him from a group of embryos purchased from Mimms.

 

[cowboybecoachin]

Congratulations to  Derrick Poe from Hamilton who  raised the steer, an embro from Mimms. The Renfros are great, honest people to work with.
Getting back to the Angus slaughter @ Ft. Worth, there are 3 points  that should be made:

1. In Texas, the Angus breed is in actuality 2 breed.:One is the carcass or pedigree people, dominated by millionares that often have no cattle background but think they can recognize quality by EPD's or on paper. They have the money and clout to promote their cattle. As we all know, the "numbers" turned in are only as good as the guy turning them in. Feed and other factors can manipulate the numbers in favor of what may be in actuality an inferior animal. Yet they may be promoted as the BEST in Beef value, rib eye area, etc.. The sale managers will help to market this questionable product because that is where the money is.Many newcomers will get sucked in by the slick promotions, only to sell out a few years later when they begin to bleed money. Many of these breeders either hate the show business or sell usually inferior show heifers to unknowing families because they have a "good pedigree". Their insistence to chase singular traits leads to inbreeding/linebreeding and can cause genetic defects, or maybe a great marbling bull that lacks muscle or structural soundness or growth. They will often state that show cattle are just pampered cattle that will not work in the "real world". They mostly promote their range bulls (rangy bulls?).
    The other type of Angus are those of usually superior muscling and bone that will also work well in the show ring. Many of the exhibitors are families that could care less about the papers, as long as they are legit, whose goal is to win a show (some may not care if the papers are legit, and this is a problem). The fact remains that a breeder is doing his customers right when he sells a functionally sound, heavy-muscled steer or heifer or breeding stock that is true to the reg.papers, and will work in both the show ring and in the pasture. That is our goal. While our show calves will get pampered, they come out of tough range conditions. Our cows must be able to turn grass into milk with relatively  little supplemental feeding. A family is doing right when they are honest in their pursuit of a champion and wish to teach their kids responsiblity and keep them in touch with ther rural heritage. I tBeleive, if done right, the show calf experience is a great family experience and teaching tool. And a lotta FUN!

The problem is when you get guys from the first group making rules or judgements on the second group. While they may be great guys and/or totally honest, when they see big boned, muscular cattle they automatically think this may not be an Angus. Especially if they have never raised a single animal that could win a stock show. Basically, these guys are not qualified to class cattle, and they are put in these places of responsibilty by show officials that also do not know a good angus from a poor Angus.

The other problem mentioned in a previous post is often the animal is classed by WHO LEADS THEM IN. There is no doubt that certain well-known show families will get theirs in most or all the time, because of who they are. i really do not mind this as much as some, because some of these families have done all the right things to win. Still, the classing should be done by trully honest, experienced, SHOW CATTLE PEOPLE. Anything else is just a crap=shoot for the exhibitor who may see their hard work and dollars go out the window by a poor classification process.

The answer is DNA. Then they are either purebred, or not.

 

[herf96]

DNA will only give you parentage.  So any commercial purebred cow or bull would be obsolete causing several breeds, mainly the brithish cattle, to limit to only papered cattle that have been DNA'd.  That will never work.  It would wreck the steer show in the south simply by not having enough cattle to produce the number of calves that show in Texas.  If they do it to one breed, the will have to do it to all.  Look at all the breeds in San Antonio and Houston alone, the number of actual calves raised from a purebred sire and a purebred dam is slim at best.  The classification guideline as set now is the best solution to the problem.  Granted that some classifiers would be better than others.  As a hereford breeder I expect that I may get one kicked out pure or not, the ball game is what it is nothing else.  Play it or stand on the side of the fence and bellyache.  I have had my fair share kicked out, the best is when you sale one and tell them he will not classify the day of purchase and 365 days later they tend to forget and get kicked out.  Love it when they come complaining after that.

 

[JSchroeder]

They don't have to test all breeds if they test one.  Angus used to be blood tested until bulls like Pistol Pete ruined it by throwing calves that blood typed Angus.  The Red Angus guys want their breed to be blood tested instead of visual partly because the extreme classification standards are reinfocing an outdated stereotype of the breed.

 

[herf96]

It still comes back to the parentage issue.  Take two purebred commercial animals breed them and get an outstanding calf and he does not test purebred because of lack of data collected then we are in the same situation as I see it.  If we have a select set of cattle that are in the pool of data then wouldn't most incorporate some of the pool in their herd to come up with the DNA strand along with using crossbred animals to help with the phenotype we are after.  Your right they would not have to do it to all breeds, but that would be the fairest way of classification for each breed.  Don't get me wrong, I do not want to see this, nor do I think it will happen.

 

[dink]

The America Hereford Association put put the following release regarding the RGC steer in Fort Worth.


Hereford Steer Wins Reserve Grand at Fort Worth
Twelve-year-old Allie Henrie, Wolfforth, Texas, exhibited her 1,320-lb. Hereford steer to the overall reserve grand champion steer title in the junior show at the Fort Worth Stock Show Feb. 4-5, beating approximately 2,600 steers. It’s the first time since 1978 that a Hereford steer has been grand or reserve overall. Henrie also earned a record $200,000 from Coors Distributing Co., Fort Worth, for the steer in the Sale of Champions Feb. 6.

The Henries purchased the September 2009 son of JCS Showtime as a 400-lb. prospect from Jay Carr of Carr Cattle Co., Sudan, Texas, and Eric Drager, of Drager Cattle Co., Texaco, N.M., who raised him.

 

[HerefordGuy]

The America Hereford Association put put the following release regarding the RGC steer in Fort Worth.


Hereford Steer Wins Reserve Grand at Fort Worth
Twelve-year-old Allie Henrie, Wolfforth, Texas, exhibited her 1,320-lb. Hereford steer to the overall reserve grand champion steer title in the junior show at the Fort Worth Stock Show Feb. 4-5, beating approximately 2,600 steers. It’s the first time since 1978 that a Hereford steer has been grand or reserve overall. Henrie also earned a record $200,000 from Coors Distributing Co., Fort Worth, for the steer in the Sale of Champions Feb. 6.

The Henries purchased the September 2009 son of JCS Showtime as a 400-lb. prospect from Jay Carr of Carr Cattle Co., Sudan, Texas, and Eric Drager, of Drager Cattle Co., Texaco, N.M., who raised him.

 

[cowboybecoachin]

I am not a complainer or whiner, and people who know me know that. But I have had 4 pure-blood registered Angus steers kicked out in the last 4 years. We and our customers are being punished for doing a good job raising superior cattle. There is no reason to beleive that there would not be plenty of Angus purebreds available for show cattle, as there are about as many reg. Angus than all other registered breds in Texas. Not saying many are producing show quality, but the potential is there.
I would have those calves that CAN be DNA'd by an approved vet (or vets) at the exhibitor's expense automatically classed. The commercial could then be classed as we do it now.
If your calf will not work as an angus, enter him where he will work.
I am not afraid of the competition from Maine influenced Angus that might slip into a show. I just wish to see the truly purebreds not get kicked out.

 

[cowboybecoachin]

By the way, the 2 steers we raised that made the sale brought about $6500 and $8400. Pretty good!

 

[BIGTEX]

I know of one Heatwave son that made it through as many others I'm sure. He got 3rd in his class.

 

[cowboybecoachin]

Another way to fix the "classification" problem is to DNA the winners. If you DNA'd the first and second place steers from each class (which would include the champions, and random test 3 others from the top 10 in each class, you could clean up the Angus show with DNA results on 15 animals. If the resulting penalty for a 'dirty" calf was to be banned for life from ever showing in Ft. Worth again, I cannot beleive anyone would chance using a cross calf  to place 3rd and get lucky and not be DNA'd. Not worth the risk, and you could not win the show.

 

[simtal]

you could get rid of the classifying by running all the breeds together like other majors do