JJP or Salute?

[OH Breeder]

Most steers at Fort Worth that win are slower growing Aprils or May-June calves.  We used to have a "tooth rule" in Texas until the early 90s.  Any of us that grew up in that era became something of experts on when steers shucked their teeth.  And it wasnt at 2 yrs old - almost all British breeds lose them significantly younger than 24 months - you would really be pushing your luck with anything older than a July calf.  Exotics held them a little longer.  Another little bit of trivia - a steer reaches their peak right about the time they spit their teeth.  So, the Ch Shorti at FW may well have lost his teeth, but I would guess he was a March or April at the oldest - no more than a month or two older than his closest competition.

Great Info. Being up north that's interesting they are showing March and Aprils.

 

[chambero]

More May-Julys in the top end, but at the oldest maybe a few slow doing Mar-Aprils.  Like I said, i know nothing about the Ch Shorti, but he may well have not had his teeth but he wasnt ancient.

 

[McM93]

Most steers at Fort Worth that win are slower growing Aprils or May-June calves.  We used to have a "tooth rule" in Texas until the early 90s.  Any of us that grew up in that era became something of experts on when steers shucked their teeth.  And it wasnt at 2 yrs old - almost all British breeds lose them significantly younger than 24 months - you would really be pushing your luck with anything older than a July calf.  Exotics held them a little longer.  Another little bit of trivia - a steer reaches their peak right about the time they spit their teeth.  So, the Ch Shorti at FW may well have lost his teeth, but I would guess he was a March or April at the oldest - no more than a month or two older than his closest competition.

This mans speaks the truth...The best steers at Fort Worth in the day had owners "sweatin' teeth" (hoping you would get "F" on jaw before they spit them)...Several spring calves at Fort Worth. June calves are the youngest calves in the barn with a chance in anything but the light weight classes. Don't know anyone that had anything to do with the champion shorthorn, but he could have easily been reserve overall and would have won many years. He was not big, but he was really good!

 

[trevorgreycattleco]

We raised a Salute steer out of a simm cow a few years ago, and could never get finish on him. He was just a HUGE framed beast, and we finally sent him to slaughter when he was 1400 pounds, with almost no finish! Here is a pic of him at about a year, next to a yearling simm heifer.

Few folks on here will tell ya Salute works just fine. Thanks for sharing Was the cow huge?

 

[OKshorthorn]

We had a salute bull calf that was out of a cow that has always done well for us. She isn't a massive old girl, but definitely not squatty! He never got that old at our place we shipped him a couple months after weaning, was tall, shallow, and just never looked like a marketable calf for us. Of course we have a Salute X Dottie 12H embryo cooking as I type that I am really excited about!

 

[kfacres]

I saw Polar Express a few years ago. IMO he had some structure issues

there is a mature, stud picture of him on here..

I might ask you>>> Have you ever seen a steer producing geared sire-- who didn't have structure problems? (pop)

 

[cjr]

The cow is moderate she is out of Warhorse TH & PHA positive.

 

[kfacres]

The cow is moderate she is out of Warhorse TH & PHA positive.

then of the list I spit off.. it has been narrowed down to:
I like Rock N Roll Train, and fringe- maybe absolutely, get serious, moose, or my favorite WILDSIDE If she's moderate_ avoid JPJ= that will just create a DINK.

FYI to all the mouthers:  I don't need a history lesson on teeth growing:  We sheep people take that overboard...

DID YOU know-- that a fall lamb- will shed is baby teeth at about 15 months of age: and then about 2 weeks later have its 2 yo teeth?  I've seen it 90% of the time..

 

[CAB]

Well I tried something new this year and I guess I will have to see what happens.  I used polar express on heatwave and a few th cows.  I'm a little nervous because of the bw's but we shall see. 

Not wanting to scare you, but I have seen some PE calves shortly after birth and they are big & stout. Watch those HW's closely.

 

[WJ Farms]

Yeah I did see him in person and just cause your friend is Judging Team coach doesnt mean he is gods gift to the show steer world and knows everything there is know about cattle!!! I know plenty of Judging team coaches that dont pick good cattle when they judge shows everybody has their own opinion!! And you may like and you may not and who cares if he was old he was champion shorthorn steer at Ft Worth!!! Im pretty sure nobody would complain about that!!! Whether he had all of his teeth or if he was so old he didnt have any teeth who gives a $h!T......He was Champion Shorthorn!!! That dude was a BEAST!!!!!

 

[firesweepranch]

We raised a Salute steer out of a simm cow a few years ago, and could never get finish on him. He was just a HUGE framed beast, and we finally sent him to slaughter when he was 1400 pounds, with almost no finish! Here is a pic of him at about a year, next to a yearling simm heifer.

Few folks on here will tell ya Salute works just fine. Thanks for sharing Was the cow huge?

Not sure, we bought him as a calf from a local breeder. We wanted to try showing a steer at the simmi regionals (which we did take him), so he needed to be half blood at least. He just never had enough finish. He was a good looking steer, plenty of meat in him. Just a really big frame.

 

[RyanChandler]

Whether he had all of his teeth or if he was so old he didnt have any teeth who gives a $h!T......He was Champion Shorthorn!!! That dude was a BEAST!!!!!

...those that don't cheat.  YOu know kinda like playing on the 11-12yr old baseball team when your 13 or playing hs football when you turned 19 before september 1st... its called cheating. Lying and cheating. 

 

[Okotoks]

I have not had much to do with either bull but have seen some offspring and descendants of both that I liked. I'm sure JPJ is the better bet for calving ease. That said one of the Salute's I am familar with, HSF XENIA DOTTIE 35X, just calved a few days ago unassisted. She had a bull calf in the 80's by K-Kim Glod Count 22P. They also report she has a beautiful udder (thumbsup)

 

[j3cattleco]

Yeah I did see him in person and just cause your friend is Judging Team coach doesnt mean he is gods gift to the show steer world and knows everything there is know about cattle!!! I know plenty of Judging team coaches that dont pick good cattle when they judge shows everybody has their own opinion!! And you may like and you may not and who cares if he was old he was champion shorthorn steer at Ft Worth!!! Im pretty sure nobody would complain about that!!! Whether he had all of his teeth or if he was so old he didnt have any teeth who gives a $h!T......He was Champion Shorthorn!!! That dude was a BEAST!!!!!

I wasn't talking to you.  I agree with you that he was a good one.

Joshua

 

[kfacres]

Well I tried something new this year and I guess I will have to see what happens.  I used polar express on heatwave and a few th cows.  I'm a little nervous because of the bw's but we shall see. 

Not wanting to scare you, but I have seen some PE calves shortly after birth and they are big & stout. Watch those HW's closely.

I agree... mine have ranged from 50-110, they follow the cow's genetics and history- almost to a T.  I haven't had one that I didn't like though- yet.  I sure hate his PHAC status though.  But has a pedigree stacked to make steers- with no Stuff..

 

[CAB]

Well I tried something new this year and I guess I will have to see what happens.  I used polar express on heatwave and a few th cows.  I'm a little nervous because of the bw's but we shall see. 

Not wanting to scare you, but I have seen some PE calves shortly after birth and they are big & stout. Watch those HW's closely.

I agree... mine have ranged from 50-110, they follow the cow's genetics and history- almost to a T.  I haven't had one that I didn't like though- yet.  I sure hate his PHAC status though.  But has a pedigree stacked to make steers- with no Stuff..

Calves that I have seen have been pretty good.

 

[WJ Farms]

Sorry I misread it I thought you made the comment I sincerely apologize!!!!

 

[chambero]

Whether he had all of his teeth or if he was so old he didnt have any teeth who gives a $h!T......He was Champion Shorthorn!!! That dude was a BEAST!!!!!

...those that don't cheat.  YOu know kinda like playing on the 11-12yr old baseball team when your 13 or playing hs football when you turned 19 before september 1st... its called cheating. Lying and cheating. 

Not sure how this thread jumped the tracks, but there is no tooth rule anymore (hasn't been since the early 90s) and there isn't an age rule on steers.  There is nothing "lying and cheating" about it.  Regardless of the lack of rules against it, you also can't win Fort Worth with a stale, old steer that has been held forever, the competition is too ridulously tough.  It doesn't matter, but I'd wager plenty of money that steer wasn't "old".  You have to use older calves for Fort Worth to get them to the proper level of maturity.  You can get a much younger calf to the weight, but you can't get them to the correct maturity level (a problem we have with our own calves).

 

[sue]

We raised a Salute steer out of a simm cow a few years ago, and could never get finish on him. He was just a HUGE framed beast, and we finally sent him to slaughter when he was 1400 pounds, with almost no finish! Here is a pic of him at about a year, next to a yearling simm heifer.

Is "duke" the same age as the black calf next to him??  1400 and that much frame .. wow.

 

[firesweepranch]

We raised a Salute steer out of a simm cow a few years ago, and could never get finish on him. He was just a HUGE framed beast, and we finally sent him to slaughter when he was 1400 pounds, with almost no finish! Here is a pic of him at about a year, next to a yearling simm heifer.

Is "duke" the same age as the black calf next to him??  1400 and that much frame .. wow.

He was about the same age, maybe a month older. When we took him to the regional show, he was the heaviest but placed near the bottom of his class because the judge said he was "disappointing" when he went to feel his finish. He "looked" good but did not follow though with adequate finish for his size. It was our first time showing a steer, and our percentage heifer (the one in my avatar) ended up winning Champion Percentage, so we did good there! We learned a lot with him, and feed our steers a little different now.