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DL

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Jan 29, 2007
Messages
3,622
Today is a wonderful day –it is 70 degrees and sunny on November 5th giving me the opportunity to move 2 ton of sand I wasn’t sure would get moved and half a ton of stone that has been in my way for too long. And I got to fix fence and generally get things organized for winter. And while in the skid steer I cogitated to the tunes of CSNY and Clapton (in his older forms) about life with a renewed excitement and enthusiasm for the future of our country. This is a great time to be an American.

My views are surely to be at odds with the vast majority of members of this board – and for that I do not apologize. I suspect most SP members are white, Christian and straight. I suspect most SP members live in a very white Christian community and surround themselves with like-minded, like skin colored individuals. Yes, the comfort zone of the familiar. (I know there are a few SP members who do not fit that mold and you know I know who you are). Your life has shaped your views, just as my views have been shaped by my experiences.

Show Heifer and Malinda talk about what their fathers taught them and the influence they had on their lives. My father gave me a great gift – from the time I was a little kid our house was filled with people from different countries, with different religions, different skin colors, different views and beliefs. These weren’t token people – they shared our food, our good times and sorrows. They were an integral part of our life. And what I learned is that basically we are all pretty much the same – most of us are good, some of us are toads, and a very rare number of us are truly evil. I also learned that people are afraid of what they don’t know.

My father taught me (much to his chagrin at times I am sure) to question everything and believe that I could be anything that I wanted – despite what society or the teachers or the neighbors said. He taught me to move out of the comfort zone and do new things, meet new people, go new places – see all the wonders the world has to offer. I am constantly amazed at the people who have never been out of their county, their state or the US. The world is an oyster filled with pearls if you have the guts to crack the shell.

I was against the war in Vietnam and I am against the war in Iraq. In 1968 I worked for Eugene McCarthy – the anti war candidate – none of us working our tails off were old enough to vote. It was the anti-war movement that led to the 26th Amendment giving 18 year olds the right to vote. I had friends who went to Nam and never came back, friends who came back and were never the same, and friends who sought sanctuary in Canada. My early experiences at home and the war shaped my beliefs about life and my country.

We were in DC at the Wall when someone said the President’s motorcade was coming. Reagan was the President and I hadn’t voted for him (imagine that!). We ran to the corner where the motorcade was passing – it was an incredible awesome moment – I was actually shocked to find that I got chills all the way from the tip of my head to my toes – I didn’t agree with much he stood for BUT he was the President of the US – the President of my country and he was the face of our nation to the world.

It occurred to me that there were many similarities between the tactics of the animal rights groups, PETA and HSUS, and the recent Republican Presidential campaign – both proselytize emotion and fear over fact. In the latter case, irrational fear of a different skin color, a different name, an unfamiliar religion  – fear of the unknown. That rhetoric is not helpful and unless we recognize the similar tactics animal agriculture as we know will be changed forever.

I think John McCain is a good and honest man who has sacrificed more than almost anyone for his country – yup, a while back I voted for McCain vs Bush in the primary because I thought he was a person who didn’t follow the crowd, used his brain, and loved his country  (we could vote in both primaries). I believe that the politics of the campaign were out of his control and he appeared to be someone he wasn’t. Last night he proved to me that he really is still a good guy – his gracious speech proved he wants what is best for the US and is willing to work to make it happen. So if you voted for McCain think about what he said – get over yourself and help us all move forward.

This is a great and historic time for American – I feel the best about our country, her place in the world and her commitment to all her citizens than I have in a very long time -  yes, I believe we can.  God bless the United States of America – we are a very special place with very special people.


 

red

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DL, although we don't see eye to eye, that was a very well put post.

Red
 

JbarL

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This is a great and historic time for American – I feel the best about our country, her place in the world and her commitment to all her citizens than I have in a very long time -  yes, I believe we can.  God bless the United States of America – we are a very special place with very special people.



[/quote]
dl...ditto on the preamble, and i have to agree on the historic times that have just begun.....thoughts like that make this a special place, and people like you make special people stand out in a crowd....thanks                        jbarl
 

rtnok

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May 1, 2007
Messages
115
I have to agree with you DL I just wish CBOT,KCBOT,AND THE STOCK MARKET would also, everything was down today. roni
 

simtal

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Feb 3, 2008
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Champaign, IL
what a load of crap, I watched the democrats this morning sit here and back slap themselves "yep, things are great, change has begun"


To compare republicans to those horrible groups is pathetic.

 

amss101

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Joined
Aug 10, 2007
Messages
198
DL- I said almost the same thing this morning-although my version was much less compared to yours.  I did not stay up to see who won, but turned the t.v. on first thing.  My two 10 year old daughters who knew I was voting for McCain, said what now mommy...I said, "We are still Americans and we're still free, I voted, I wasn't the majority, and we will now support our new president until he does something that we can't support.  And we'll hope he doesn't!"  But know I am one of those surround myself with familiarity, and probably don't have enough diversity in my life but if Condeleza Rice had ran, I might have tried to vote twice!!
 

knabe

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Hollister, CA
JbarL said:
simtal said:
To compare republicans to those horrible groups is pathetic.

but who will the republicians have  to compare themselves to  now  ??  oh my....  :eek:    jbarl

constrast is the word jbarl!  they've tried to be democrats and failed.  look at our deficit and it's not all the war.
 

JbarL

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amss101 said:
DL- I said almost the same thing this morning-although my version was much less compared to yours.  I did not stay up to see who won, but turned the t.v. on first thing.  My two 10 year old daughters who knew I was voting for McCain, said what now mommy...I said, "We are still Americans and we're still free, I voted, I wasn't the majority, and we will now support our new president until he does something that we can't support.  And we'll hope he doesn't!"  But know I am one of those surround myself with familiarity, and probably don't have enough diversity in my life but if Condeleza Rice had ran, I might have tried to vote twice!!
i remember when i was ten or so....the only things we ever remember hearing  our folks and grandfolks complain about was taxes/ not enough rock on the road and line fences....we've brought young kids into this like its there problem to be a part of solving  already....like we actually expect our kids to understand/ or have an opinion/  or give ourselves a reason to even let them here this nonsense......do we really expect them to be an active  part of this, and have them start "shaping" there political tones, like we expect them to be polite in public, and wipe there nose on a hankie insead of there sleeve.?.....seems "back in the day"....if things were as bad as we say there are now , or may actually be..... i think the last generations or two would have shielded there children from any fear driven social issues of the times, at any cost ( depression/ww1 ww2/ ).........kinda make them not feel like they dont need to  get involved and worried about it...thats the kinda stuff we'd have to stay up late and sneek out and listen to during the "adult conversations"...during a rousing late night (9:00 pm) rook rematch....jbarl
 

OH Breeder

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DL thank you for such a thoughtful post.

As they say, you can please some of the people some of the time, but you never please all the people all the time.
 

chambero

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John McCain's comes from a family that has truly dedicated their lives to serving their country.  Mr. McCain has more than proven himself to be as good a man and leader as they come.  He probably was closer than we can imagine to making the ultimate sacrifice and was obviously willing to do so.  I truly hate that he had to suffer defeat.  No republican was going to win this election however.

Mr. Obama comes from a very different background.  Obviously from a very rebellious mother and who knows what his father really was.  But he was raised by a grandmother that started as a secretary and worked her way up to the top of a bank.  She couldn't have been a better example of hard work.  I hope he truly has his foundation from her.  If he does, he represents the best in this country.  I don't like his name, but that's probably unfair of me.  He could have changed it, but didn't.  If he had, he would have probably had an easier time in life.  Mr. Obama may represent someone that worked very hard to get where he is and didn't have a thing handed to him.  I hope that proves right.

I didn't vote for him, but I hope he does a great job as president.  I hate how we tear down whoever is in office.  I do think he has a chance to be infinitely better than the last two democratic candidates.  He does come across as a leader, which I think is the most important job requirement of the president.  His predecessors didn't.

I do not believe a non-Christian should ever be president of this country.  Our country wasn't founded by atheists or non-Christians.  We cross a line if we ever try to go there.  Obama is a Christian, but that name will take some getting used to.
 

jnm

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Joined
Apr 17, 2007
Messages
86
"irrational fear of a different skin color, a different name, an unfamiliar religion" 

DL: it sounds as if you have listened to the media too much. I believe I'm like a lot of people. I have no problem with skin color, religion, or name. I do have a problem with card check, the fairness doctrine, increased taxes on capital gains, dividends and estates, the pledge to bankrupt coal power plants,  a refusal to expand drilling, and many other items. However I'm told these items are not important and I would only vote against him because "he's different" Give me a break!

 

harley

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Joined
Aug 13, 2008
Messages
61
DL said:
Today is a wonderful day –it is 70 degrees and sunny on November 5th giving me the opportunity to move 2 ton of sand I wasn’t sure would get moved and half a ton of stone that has been in my way for too long. And I got to fix fence and generally get things organized for winter. And while in the skid steer I cogitated to the tunes of CSNY and Clapton (in his older forms) about life with a renewed excitement and enthusiasm for the future of our country. This is a great time to be an American.

My views are surely to be at odds with the vast majority of members of this board – and for that I do not apologize. I suspect most SP members are white, Christian and straight. I suspect most SP members live in a very white Christian community and surround themselves with like-minded, like skin colored individuals. Yes, the comfort zone of the familiar. (I know there are a few SP members who do not fit that mold and you know I know who you are). Your life has shaped your views, just as my views have been shaped by my experiences.

Show Heifer and Malinda talk about what their fathers taught them and the influence they had on their lives. My father gave me a great gift – from the time I was a little kid our house was filled with people from different countries, with different religions, different skin colors, different views and beliefs. These weren’t token people – they shared our food, our good times and sorrows. They were an integral part of our life. And what I learned is that basically we are all pretty much the same – most of us are good, some of us are toads, and a very rare number of us are truly evil. I also learned that people are afraid of what they don’t know.

My father taught me (much to his chagrin at times I am sure) to question everything and believe that I could be anything that I wanted – despite what society or the teachers or the neighbors said. He taught me to move out of the comfort zone and do new things, meet new people, go new places – see all the wonders the world has to offer. I am constantly amazed at the people who have never been out of their county, their state or the US. The world is an oyster filled with pearls if you have the guts to crack the shell.

I was against the war in Vietnam and I am against the war in Iraq. In 1968 I worked for Eugene McCarthy – the anti war candidate – none of us working our tails off were old enough to vote. It was the anti-war movement that led to the 26th Amendment giving 18 year olds the right to vote. I had friends who went to Nam and never came back, friends who came back and were never the same, and friends who sought sanctuary in Canada. My early experiences at home and the war shaped my beliefs about life and my country.

We were in DC at the Wall when someone said the President’s motorcade was coming. Reagan was the President and I hadn’t voted for him (imagine that!). We ran to the corner where the motorcade was passing – it was an incredible awesome moment – I was actually shocked to find that I got chills all the way from the tip of my head to my toes – I didn’t agree with much he stood for BUT he was the President of the US – the President of my country and he was the face of our nation to the world.

It occurred to me that there were many similarities between the tactics of the animal rights groups, PETA and HSUS, and the recent Republican Presidential campaign – both proselytize emotion and fear over fact. In the latter case, irrational fear of a different skin color, a different name, an unfamiliar religion  – fear of the unknown. That rhetoric is not helpful and unless we recognize the similar tactics animal agriculture as we know will be changed forever.

I think John McCain is a good and honest man who has sacrificed more than almost anyone for his country – yup, a while back I voted for McCain vs Bush in the primary because I thought he was a person who didn’t follow the crowd, used his brain, and loved his country  (we could vote in both primaries). I believe that the politics of the campaign were out of his control and he appeared to be someone he wasn’t. Last night he proved to me that he really is still a good guy – his gracious speech proved he wants what is best for the US and is willing to work to make it happen. So if you voted for McCain think about what he said – get over yourself and help us all move forward.

This is a great and historic time for American – I feel the best about our country, her place in the world and her commitment to all her citizens than I have in a very long time -  yes, I believe we can.  God bless the United States of America – we are a very special place with very special people.

"It's a great time to be an American" ... more so than yesterday or the day before?  Has the mere fact that obama got elected somehow improved your way of life?  
"I suspect most SP members are white, Christian and straight. I suspect most SP members live in a very white Christian community and surround themselves with like-minded, like skin colored individuals. Yes, the comfort zone of the familiar. (I know there are a few SP members who do not fit that mold and you know I know who you are). Your life has shaped your views, just as my views have been shaped by my experiences."     I can't even begin to express how p****d off that comment makes me.  I've read your posts long enough to know that my view on your comment will mean nothing to you, and that by stating my feelings on the matter I'm setting myself up for a verbal beating from you, but I'm just so sick of people generalizing a groups of people!  YES I'm white, I'm christian and straight, and for you to imply that I could only have a certain belief system because of that is as racist as someone stating African Americans all like watermelon.  You act like if you're white, christian and straight that you couldn't understand things like discrimination, that you couldn't have an original thought in your head reguarding political issues and we all live the good life.  I've never "surrounded" myself with anyone, my neighbors are who they are.  I've lived here all of my life and never felt like only white, christian straight people could be my friends.  
My parents taught me lots of things too.  When I became an adult I chose the beliefs I wanted to hold on to and the ones I didn't quite buy.  I wish we never had to have war, but as long as humans are sinners, we're going to have them.  I wonder if you believe there is ever a time when it is acceptable to go to war?  What would be the circumstances that would have to occur in order for  you to approve of a war?  Just curious...  
I hope your euphoria is long lived, just don't bust my chops because I don't share your enthusiasm.
 

knabe

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it's easy to be magnanimous  in victory,  just ask the democrats after bush won both times and the vile that repeatedly comes out of pelosi and reid's mouth.  i'm not buying it that holding hands and having solidarity is the right thing to do.  every place that looks like that have thugs at the top.  free speech and guns seem to disappear rather quickly.

the hurricane season the last 2 years has been below normal. democrats and environmentalists have been preaching fear and profiting from it.  this notion that only republicans use fear is just a plain lie.  this year was the lowest activity in 30 years.  we are cooler this year already, but where is al gore.  why of course he's preaching more fear.  so is the new head of the epa.  fear fear fear.  add to that the mandate to inject this into our kids head and that the media and the schools lack ANY diversity on perspective is disgusting.  the left, so "welcoming" of diversity, actually abhors it.

gay marriage.  gay marriage is the ultimate discrimination.  there are two of the same sex.  where's the diversity in that?  2nd,  people can have all the rights they want, but stealing the word to devalue a tradition from a group they detest and try to limit at every turn is just plain hatred.  i grew up with brian boitano and other kids who were gay.  the only thing we did was giggle and poked good fun back and forth.  this notion that one can only crack jokes at themselves is so unequal it's ridiculous.  logic dictates that you should be able to joke about everyone, then you have a truer, though not true equality.  there is no such thing as equality.  it's an ideal that only exists in heaven, something the left doesn't believe exists anyway.

happily, one doesn't have to believe in words, but only deeds.  the deeds will start showing up quickly.

here's some more evidence.

President-elect Barack Obama will reach to the middle and offer more than just-for-show appointments to Republicans in his administration, friends and colleagues predicted Wednesday.

An Obama administration “will be reasonable and logical, not ideological,” Virginia Gov. Tim Kaine told The Washington Times in an interview. “It will be about results, not rhetoric.” Mr. Kaine is a longtime friend of Mr. Obama’s and an early backer who campaigned extensively for the Illinois Democrat and has advised him informally on economic matters.

Mr. Kaine speculated that Mr. Obama would run “a very progressive administration,” but also one that will try to find “pragmatic” solutions to problems.

this is pretty funny.  progressivism is rhetoric, and it is partisan, and it is not about results other than the elimination of opposition.  not sure what is pragmatic about progressivism other than to eliminate the oppostion by making them pay for their own elimination.  sort of a double whammy.  efficient.  schools plus the media, another double whammy.  no diversity at all and what there is, progressives want to shut it down.  all soooo clear.

 

SWMO

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It occurs to me that the only racist people in this country by and far are the ones that keep accusing the white male of being racist.  Without the white male vote President Elect Obama would not be President Elect Obama.

Now those people that have accused the white establishment of holding them back in poverty will now have no one to blame but themselves for their lot in life.  Life is good.  It is now not my fault that an individual lives in a a ghetto and deals drugs because it is the only vocation made available to him or her.
 

frostback

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White, Christian, and straight.

First time sexual preference has been mentioned,,,, anything you want to tell us DL. JK  ;D
Your post was very thought provoking but since I have not had all the experience you have I feel I am so inferior I cannot answer to it. I sure wish I could be all you are, and still have the time to teach us lower intellectually forms just how bad we are for living where we do and not going to the inner cities to be around the minorities you have been around. Sure glad you are around to do your community service here and set us straight. 
 

kanshow

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Kansas
Good Post DL.

I have to say that race was NEVER an issue with how my vote was going to be cast.  I made my decisions on other factors.  During the campaign,  I felt that McCain was stifled due to the race card but what do you do..    According to the Obama marketers, it wasn't about the race during the campaign.  Then 10 seconds after he wins, it's all about race.   
 

DLD

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sw Oklahoma
With all respect DL, I'm dissapointed.  Your post is full of the very same type of generalizations it accuses others of.  I congratulate you on "being on the winning team", but please understand that most of us voted for McCain for many different valid reasons that have nothing to do with his opponents race or his name.  Sadly some did, but no more than those that voted for Obama because of the color of his skin and/or his name.  I think most of the people here deserve more credit for making an informed decision about who to vote for than your post implies.

No matter how we voted, he's everybody's president now - he said so himself.  Time to move past all this.
 

Jill

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I grew up attending church at 7th and Washington Blvd. in the blackest part of Kansas City and I can assure you that your post is the biggest bunch of racist crap I have seen in print over this election yet.  I am free, white, Christian and thank God straight and I can assure you I voted the way I did over a whole list of proposed policy issues that have absolutely nothing to do with what color the canidate was. 
I sat there election night and watched as the media brought on guest after guest from John Lewis to Moorehead College and you know what, they were all black,  99% of them weren't happy because Obama was winning, or because the right man was winning, they were applauding the fact that a black man was winning and they had made history by voting for him, now you tell me who played the race card.

 

SWMO

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Messages
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Carthage MO
DL  -    I truly voted for the individual that would do the most justice for our country both here and over seas.  I have never seen myself as racist.  I am prejudiced against white, black, yellow or any other skin color that uses their color or their sex as an excuse to not work.

I am always appalled when I drive by public housing that is only a few years old and is already uninhabitable.  It just proves that if you are given everything in life you value nothing.  Not the roof over your head, the clothes on you back or the lives around you.

More people have been murdered in Chicago over the past year than have been killed serving in Iraq this year.  What does that say for the state of Chicago and their governing body.

Is this the "First time you were ever proud to be an American."  Michelle Obama.  Is there another country out there that serves it citizens as loyally as our government does.  Is there a better country to live in?

DL  I have to respectfully disagree with you on this.  I am very proud to be an American.  I am also proud to be white, christian and straight.  Why is it wrong for me to be white, straight and Christian  and proud as opposed to a person of another color or race that is proud of their heritage their religion or sexual orientation.
 
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