Preferred Preg Check Method?

[DL]

Palpations cause abortions

Zach - you are incorrect my friend - palpation DOES NOT cause abortion and there is research to show that -I think I posted it on here a while ago- basically they looked at 3 groups after AI - palpation, US and nothing - embryonic loss (which occurs relatively frequently in the 1st 40 days) was actually higher in the group not checked as I recall. Furthermore manually trying to terminate an early normal pregnancy is physically difficult even for big strong young guys -so the bottom line is that palpation DIES not cause early embryonic loss of normal embryos. If you ultrasound you can tell if the embryo has a heart beat or is dead; a "dead" embryo would still palpate pregnant for about 30 days until the conceptus is eliminated

 

[Mill Iron A]

One limitation on Biopryn is that in multi-parous cows the pregnancy specific protein B can be active for 75-90 days post partum which could cause some issues with efficacy.

 

[farmboy]

I'll just go over here and stand in the corner then...

 

[DL]

I'll just go over here and stand in the corner then...

you can come out now 

glad to see the donkey back again

Mill Iron - persistence of the pregnancy protein can lead to false positive tests (ie the test says she is pg but she isn't - it is left over protein from the last pregnancy

 

[ai er]

We synchronize, AI, and immediately turn the bull out. Let the vet palpate 60 days after bull is pulled. He's pretty good at it, and it keeps us on good terms with him.  He gets some easy work, instead of all "fire engine" work. (emergencies)

 

[DL]

We synchronize, AI, and immediately turn the bull out. Let the vet palpate 60 days after bull is pulled. He's pretty good at it, and it keeps us on good terms with him.  He gets some easy work, instead of all "fire engine" work. (emergencies)

and that my friend is a sure way to make sure he comes when the fire is hot

 

[Boot Jack Bulls]

We have used blood test for a few years now since we only AI a small group each year. The thing I will say as that if a group of "never miss" cows come up open, call the lab and re-test. We learned that lesson the hard way! Last year 3 of our very best cows came up open by blood test. They were all aged cows, so we shipped em Monday morning. The lab called Monday afternoon and said that there was a mix up. A tech had mis-read the results and those 3 head were actually 60 days along. We tried to track down the cows, but they went through slaughter before we could find them. This tech ended up costing them a lot of insurance money! Besides our samples, this person also mis-read some from registered dairy herds who luted their cows the same day and aborted several head. Like I said, lesson learned, always re-test before shipping!!!

 

[BadgerFan]

We synchronize, AI, and immediately turn the bull out. Let the vet palpate 60 days after bull is pulled. He's pretty good at it, and it keeps us on good terms with him.  He gets some easy work, instead of all "fire engine" work. (emergencies)

and that my friend is a sure way to make sure he comes when the fire is hot

DL, I get your point, but I would think $100 an hour or whatever astranomical fee I must pay him would be enough to make sure he comes whenever needed.

 

[DL]

We synchronize, AI, and immediately turn the bull out. Let the vet palpate 60 days after bull is pulled. He's pretty good at it, and it keeps us on good terms with him.  He gets some easy work, instead of all "fire engine" work. (emergencies)

and that my friend is a sure way to make sure he comes when the fire is hot

DL, I get your point, but I would think $100 an hour or whatever astranomical fee I must pay him would be enough to make sure he comes whenever needed.

My plumber charges $75 per hour plus mileage - he knows more about plumbing than I ever will - I do not begrudge him what he charges

Working on my farm machinery is $80 and hour and if it is hauled away that is $80 per hour too - they come, they fix it and get it back to me - they provide a service I need and I do not begrudge them the cost

Body work after the deer attacked the truck $80 per hour - again they have skills that I do not - I do not begrudge them their cost

When I rented a bulldozer it was $125 per hour (I don't think the bulldozer had any student loans either) - I needed the bulldozer and sure couldn't afford to buy one

More and more vets are not doing emergency work for people who are not clients who do not give the vet some "gravy work" - you couldn't pay me enough to get up in the middle of the night and deal with a non clients  mess

 

[BadgerFan]

do you hire the plumber to fill your water tank?  The bull dozer guy to drag the driveway?  They might like some "gravy work" also.

 

[DL]

do you hire the plumber to fill your water tank?  The bull dozer guy to drag the driveway?  They might like some "gravy work" also.

You are missing the point - routine work is gravy work that insures that if there is an emergency they will come - if the pump breaks in the middle of the night the on call plumber comes and fixes it because he does all the other routine work. If the hydrant leaks under ground in the middle of the snow storm and floods the barn the bulldozer guy comes and fixes it because he did all my gravy work - if you need help with a dystocia in the middle of the night who do you think the vet will go to 1st -the guy where he does all the routine work including preg checking or the guy who only calls when the barn is on fire? Around here the latter is way lower on the list of all veterinarians I know

 

[BadgerFan]

I do get what you're saying, I guess I just disagree.  Vets, excavators and plumbers are business people and you and I are their customers.  They come out to fix problems because people pay them to fix problems. I can do the routine stuff myself- I can turn a wrench, run a skidsteer, and take care of a cow.  It's when the big things come up that I need specialized service.  I pay that person dearly to do it, like I said in my first post.  Customers are not required to provide vets with routine work so they will do us the "favor" of coming when something bad happens.  The attitude that I "owe" anything to a vet just so that he'll provide me service is ridiculous and any business person with that attitude won't be in business long.

FWIW- my vets and I get along great. They appreciate that I don't call them for every little thing. 

It's been a good point/counterpoint and I hope you see my side.  If not, I'll be happy to explain again.  Otherwise, I'm fine with leaving it at a difference of opinion.

 

[hamburgman]

Just to be clear BadgerFan, are you buying your medications, wormers and such through the vet clinic also?

 

[BadgerFan]

Yes, some of that kind of stuff.  I buy my prostaglandins, GnRH and vaccines through the vet clinic.  Smaller items are usually bought at the farm supply store or online. 

 

[hamburgman]

Most vets would be happy with that kind of partnership it seems.  They wouldn't be ok with you having another vet who does preg checks cheaper do that work and get stuck doing your midnight C-sections.  I believe that is a big part of what DL is saying