Shorthorn question

[firesweepranch]

OK, so I was looking at the on-line catalog for the Sullivan sale (maternal legends), and being a Simmy breeder I am a bit confused. How can a heifer be registered a "purebred shorthorn" and a "maintainer"? ??? Also, what does the * and x mean after the registration mean?
thanks for your help! My daughter would love to find a good shorthorn to drag around the shows with her Simmi's, I am just not sure what to do with it after we are done showing! I don't have a clue about breeding shorthorns, and by listening to the discussions on this board, I am not sure I want to!!!

 

[Okotoks]

OK, so I was looking at the on-line catalog for the Sullivan sale (maternal legends), and being a Simmy breeder I am a bit confused. How can a heifer be registered a "purebred shorthorn" and a "maintainer"? ??? Also, what does the * and x mean after the registration mean?
thanks for your help! My daughter would love to find a good shorthorn to drag around the shows with her Simmi's, I am just not sure what to do with it after we are done showing! I don't have a clue about breeding shorthorns, and by listening to the discussions on this board, I am not sure I want to!!!

The Maine Anjou purebred reds are eligible at 3/4 status so their ofspring coud be double registered Maintainer and Shorthorn.
3. Related Breed Entry: Other Shorthorns (i.e. Milking Shorthorns) shall enter the
American Shorthorn Association Herd Book at same level in which they are recorded
by their herd record. Registered Maine-Anjou (with a red color designation) shall
enter the American Shorthorn Association Herd Book at the 3/4 level. Maine-Anjou
shall receive the prefix MA prior to registration number. Effective August 1, 2008
Maine Anjou shall be considered ShorthornPlus and receive the AR prefix prior to
their registration number. Lincoln Reds shall enter the American Shorthorn
Association Herd Book at the 100% level.

x is used to designate a polled animal

* indicates an animal being bred up from the appendix program as per rule below.
d. Herd Record Designation: All ShorthornPlus cattle which enter the American
Shorthorn Association Herd Record shall carry an asterisk in front of the
registration number. This will be permanent and will appear on the pedigree of
all progeny descending from ShorthornPlus parents. The asterisk will be
removed when a Shorthorn achieves 127/128 Shorthorn blood concentration

And despite what sometimes appears on this board there are a lot of really great breeders with good cattle across North America that will be pleased to help you. As well the ASA has great junior program.

Here is the PDF for the ASA rules and regulations.

http://www.shorthorn.org/Images/registration/rules/Rules%20%20Regs%20Aug15%202011_.pdf

 

[DL]

OK, so I was looking at the on-line catalog for the Sullivan sale (maternal legends), and being a Simmy breeder I am a bit confused. How can a heifer be registered a "purebred shorthorn" and a "maintainer"? ??? Also, what does the * and x mean after the registration mean?
thanks for your help! My daughter would love to find a good shorthorn to drag around the shows with her Simmi's, I am just not sure what to do with it after we are done showing! I don't have a clue about breeding shorthorns, and by listening to the discussions on this board, I am not sure I want to!!!

As okotoks mentioned a red or red and white purebred or full blood Maine can be dual registered as a 75% Shorthorn, so bred to a purebred Shorthorn the offspring can be registered either or both ways -you can breed up from the  Shorthorn Plus registry to Shorthorn registry in 2 generations (15/16ths) - the ASA has a really good junior program

 

[firesweepranch]

So why (or how) does the shorthorn breed allow a Maine to be registered as a 3/4 shorthorn when they have no shorthorn in them??? That makes no sense. Now I am really confused. I understand the breeding up part (we do that with Simmi's), but a Simmi can not be registered a simmi without Sim in them! In order to show as a Simmental, they MUST be half blood Sim or higher...

 

[knabe]

So why (or how) does the shorthorn breed allow a Maine to be registered as a 3/4 shorthorn when they have no shorthorn in them???

um, they have shorthorn in them about 75%

 

[firesweepranch]

So why (or how) does the shorthorn breed allow a Maine to be registered as a 3/4 shorthorn when they have no shorthorn in them???

um, they have shorthorn in them about 75%

So a Maine is actually a shorthorn? So is the Maine not really pure then? Why are they two separate breeds if they are basically the same? Sorry for the questions, I just want to get this straight in my brain!

 

[Okotoks]

So why (or how) does the shorthorn breed allow a Maine to be registered as a 3/4 shorthorn when they have no shorthorn in them???

um, they have shorthorn in them about 75%

So a Maine is actually a shorthorn? So is the Maine not really pure then? Why are they two separate breeds if they are basically the same? Sorry for the questions, I just want to get this straight in my brain!

Maines are a pure breed but when they were developed in France they used a lot of Shorthorn bulls with a french breed to get the type they wanted.(Knabe probably can give the details)

 

[justintime]

The Shorthorn breed is one of the older recognized breeds and they have been used in the development of over 80 breeds of cattle around the world. Google lists over 800 breeds of cattle recognized in the world, so there lots that we are unfamiliar with. Maine Anjou are generally asccepted as being 75% ( or more) Shorthorn blood, and this is probably why, until DNA tested was developed, it was very hard to distinguisg between animals from each breed by blood type alone. Some examples of breeds with Shorthorn heritage are: Maine Anjou, Lincoln Red, Droughtmaster ( Australia mainly), Santa Gerturdis, Speckle Park, Normandy, Belmont Reds, etc.
Some breed historys even suggest that the Angus breed was developed from some early Shorthorn lines. ( I would have no idea if this is true or not, but the two breeds were developed on farms very close to each other)

Every breed had to develop from something. All breeds have been developed by genetic matings of specific traits and selection. Once they have been recognized as a breed, then they decide on the rules of what a purebred animal consists of

 

[thunderdownunder]

The Shorthorn breed is one of the older recognized breeds and they have been used in the development of over 80 breeds of cattle around the world. Google lists over 800 breeds of cattle recognized in the world, so there lots that we are unfamiliar with. Maine Anjou are generally asccepted as being 75% ( or more) Shorthorn blood, and this is probably why, until DNA tested was developed, it was very hard to distinguisg between animals from each breed by blood type alone. Some examples of breeds with Shorthorn heritage are: Maine Anjou, Lincoln Red, Droughtmaster ( Australia mainly), Santa Gerturdis, Speckle Park, Normandy, Belmont Reds, etc.
Some breed historys even suggest that the Angus breed was developed from some early Shorthorn lines. ( I would have no idea if this is true or not, but the two breeds were developed on farms very close to each other)

Every breed had to develop from something. All breeds have been developed by genetic matings of specific traits and selection. Once they have been recognized as a breed, then they decide on the rules of what a purebred animal consists of

Add to that list Murray Greys!

 

[Okotoks]

Here is a link to a brief history of Maine Anjou. They refer to Shorthorns as "Durhams" another name used to refer to Shorthorns but I don't believe it was ever officially used by any of the national associations. It is still used in some promotions like the "Durhams For Denver Sale"

http://www.ansi.okstate.edu/breeds/cattle/maineanjou/index.htm

 

[shortdawg]

About 40 breeds of cattle have some Shorthorn parentage. There are many Shorthorn breeders including myself that would be more than happy to help you in any way.

 

[phillse]

Bringing  this old topic back up.



Excerpt from Rules and Regulations
Related Breed Entry: Other Shorthorns (i.e. Milking Shorthorns)
shall enter the American Shorthorn Association Herd Book at same
level in which they are recorded by their herd record. Lincoln Reds
shall enter the American Shorthorn Association Herd Book at the
100% level.

What breeds are "related breeds"?

 

[aj]

I had also heard that the Gelhvieh were the same cattle as Simmental over in the old country. The were on either sides of a mountain divide and selection goals for color were different?

 

[garett]

Sent you a PM Firesweepranch!

 

[phillse]

Bringing  this old topic back up.



Excerpt from Rules and Regulations
Related Breed Entry: Other Shorthorns (i.e. Milking Shorthorns)
shall enter the American Shorthorn Association Herd Book at same
level in which they are recorded by their herd record. Lincoln Reds
shall enter the American Shorthorn Association Herd Book at the
100% level.

What breeds are "related breeds"?

I brought this question up because in the 90's there was a pamphlet listing related breeds and what percentage shorthorn they could be brought into the ASA herd book.  If memory is correct it listed Milking Shorthorn, Illawarra Shorthorn, Lincoln Red, and Maine Anjou.  I can not find the  pamphlet nor do I remember the percentages.  I was just curious if a Santa Gertrudis could be brought in at 5/8 blood or say a Beefmaster at 1/4 blood.  No malice or motive behind the question just a question of curiosity because I don't remember Santa Gertrudis  or Beefmasters being listed as related breeds in the pamphlet.

 

[aj]

Interesting.....I would guess that the national directors would have to approve it. I have heard that the directors had close votes on the Maine Anjou deal......I think it was voted on in the early 80's.

 

[jbzdad]

so can I ask the question a different way? are any of the solid red shorthorn bulls that are good  still registered as maine or maintainer and is semen available?

 

[shortyjock89]

Yes, yes, and yes.

Red Reward, Red Demand, Red Resolve, Simplify, Red Power, and several others.

We've got a double registered Shorthorn/Mainetainer showing right now that is extremely competitive. She placed 2nd in a very hard class at NAILE in the open Shorthorn show and will show Mainetainer occasionally. We plan to make many dual registered heifers with Red Power, Red Demand and Red Reward.

 

[jbzdad]

so could that be my answer to these taller maine females that need more " middle" ?

what about semen availability .. red reward says not available ?

can you post a pic of your heifer?

 

[shortyjock89]

This is the Red Demand heifer about 10 days before NAILE.

Red Reward isn't so easy to come by, but Red Demand, Red Resolve, and Simplify should be easy enough to get.