Some herd sires from the past

[OH Breeder]

Here is a video of one of our Cumberland Gay Lad sons. I don't think too many guys would guess that he is by a bull from the 1960's.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=S5-erIXgSV0&list=UUVm2BIPcPU_glRRjzukpMzg

Where is that darn "LIKE" button?  (thumbsup)

 

[coyote]

Another bull sired by a bull from the 1960's, Bonnyview Hero 7Z X

http://www.youtube.com/watch?list=UUVm2BIPcPU_glRRjzukpMzg&v=G1KdcSFNjtQ&feature=player_detailpage

 

[renegadelivestock]

i like that thomas leader and the pheasant bull 1,2 the best.

your picks are both by Kinnaber Leader 6th

we have a pheasant creeks leader son we used a little bit last year,and based on what i have on the ground so far, i will be using him more this year, he is a maternal brother to HC timeline

 

[Shorthorns4us]

;D  The most recent two videos of those bulls are great!  I love how those bulls are soooo wild---- LOL.  You guys up north have got it going on--  Those bulls in the video are thinking-  "Well, I guess I will walk around if I have to"
I am guessing that is their all around disposition anytime of the day.
EF

 

[Cabanha Santa Isabel - BR]

My father who will turn 81 in June....  saw alot of the bulls in the post in person. He visited Louada twice a year and used alot of western canadian bulls too.

When he sees old semen or embryo matings  listed he just chuckles and says " have we screwed things up that much"?  I often wonder if he's right . But he argues the muscle vs white meat and no milk .
Heres a guy that lived through the 80's calving the "monsters" and frankly was better then most vets getting "one" out alive.

My recent visit(s) this past summer/ fall would solidify some of what he says is right. There is a reason some of those old cows look so "chubby" .... the nurse cows were feeding the calves. All I can say is be careful before you plunge. I personally have lost interest.

But hey I have Leader 9th semen for sale ;D

Also have lots of Leader 9th semen (not for sale), some old bulls also are on my tank, unhappily few straws.
Thanks for suggest this topic is amazing!!!

 

[Cabanha Santa Isabel - BR]

I have :

Cumberland Gay Lad
Scotsdale Rodney
Ready Go
Weston Secretariat
Glenford Curt( 1980 US National Champion in Fort Worth)
Ayatollah
Cactus Flat Ringmaster ( Ayatollah son who was  Champion at 1980 World show in Louisville)
HC Changing Times 85K  ( Senior Champion at the 1980 American Polled Congress in Kansas City
Huberdale Mastercharge
Deerpark Leader 13th ( Dividend)
AF Dividend Dealer 2
Mandalong Super Flag ( 90 vials)
Four Point Major  ( 100 vials)
Banner Royal Oak
Mandalong Super Elephant ( 1)
NVS Shadrack
IDS Duke of Dublin  ( about 1200 straws)
Highfield Irish Mist ( 5 straws in Canada also about 12 straws stored in the US)
Gotho Signal 3rd  ( imported Lincoln Red  - from England)
Meadowbrook Prince 16th
Meadowbrook Roan Chief
Claydene Everreddy
HUBS Director
Kenmar Lancer 58L
Green Row Dominator ( by Hillview Hobo)
Seagrave Royal Imperial ( dual purpose Shorthorn from the 60s)
Diamond Captain Mark 27C   (not sure if he counts as a sire from the past )
Marc 1V


I know I am forgetting some, so i will have to check my inventory book which is not here right now. I lost several sires from the past, a few years ago when I had a tank rupture. I lost over 100 straws of Pheasant Creek Leader 4th, and semen from 4 different Gloriadale sires from the 60s, including  the only 20 vials of Gloriadale Bonaparte in N America, as he was exported to South Africa.I also lost 32 embryos in that tank. There are 6 full tanks here at the farm, along with a few thousand doses stored in three different studs. My wife says that day 2 of my dispersal will be just semen and embryos. She may be right!
I also inherited Craig Andrew's semen tank after he passed away, and I haven't gone through it yet. I imagine there may be some gems of old sires in it as well.

(clapping) (clapping) (clapping) (clapping) (clapping) (lol)
OS WONDERFUL INVORY!!! MUST GET AN OLD 100% COW (NATIVE) TO ORDER SOME EMBRYOS FROM YOU WITH THESE SIRES.
(clapping) (clapping) (clapping) (clapping)

I'M JEALOUS!

ALSO OWN 9 LINCOLN RED OLD BULLS FROM 60'S

 

[Cabanha Santa Isabel - BR]

Here is video of Mandalong Super Flag

http://www.browarny.com/legacy/video/clip27.html

There are several lines of bulls originating in Western Canada that descend in the paternal line from Manadalong Super Flag. Mandalong Super Flag was born in Australia in 1971 and imported to Canada in 1972 by Gary and Terry Carter, Newbiggon Shorthorns. Super Flag was a Grand Champion at the Denver  National Western Stock Show. In Canada Super Flag had a huge influence.
The one line was the Eionmor Ideals. They descend from Mandalong Super Flag through Miami Flag 10G, Winalot Big Mac, Lanalta Whiteout. Whiteout was the sire of the Ideals. The one son Eionmor Ideal 69F was a very well muscled bull. He in turn sired Muridale Buster 14K, Eionmor Ideal 4M, Eionmor Ideal 25M, Eionmor Ideal  61M and Eionmor Ideal 50P. Muridale Buster 14K sired Muridale Buster  2nd 76P plus innumerable others. 4M sired Six S Samson 25S and Six S Ranger 12R. Eionmor Ideal 50P was a senior sire at Eionmor and a son Eionmor Ideal 82T is now in service. The Buster and Ideal 61M are definitely calving ease lines.
Another sire line descending from Flag through Eionmor are the Eionmor Mr. Gus bulls. Flag sired Crowfoot Flag, sire of the Gafa Mochican bull used at Eionmor for several years. There he sired Eionmor Mr. Gus 30B, Eionmor Mr Gus 80C, Eionmor Mr Gus 85C, Eionmor Mr Gus 58F. The Eionmor Highlanders were sons of 80C. Another 80C son was Glenford Gus 4H in turn the sire of Star P Matrix a popular sire first at Butterfield’s and then at Horseshoe Creek and ACC Cattle in Saskatchewan. Also by 80C are Studers Pretender 96th and TM Gus 36S.
Still a third line was the Ultra line. Flag sired Crestdale Super Flag 14G a high selling bull at the Regina Bull sale. 14G sired Manitoba Sunrise used at Saskvalley and Huberdale.  A son of Manitoba Sunrise was Butterfield Ultramarine used at Eionmor where he sired Eionmor Ultra 8C the sire of Eionmor Ultra 88G. In turn 88G sired the likes of Alta Cedar Ultimate 130K used at Muridale and Evergreen and Alta cedar ultimate 8J used at Saskvalley.  One of 8J’s sons with huge impact is Saskvalley Navajo 153M now being used at Nick Steinke and Saskvalley Pioneer 126P a National Champion bull for Horseshoe Creek and Fantasy Lane with calves worldwide. This line is being carried on at Eionmor with senior herd sire Eionmor Ultra 4M.
Newbiggon Supreme was a son of Mandalong Super Flag, out of the imported Australian cow Mandalong Roany 51st. He was a twin born with Newbiggon Powerline used in the D’N Eden and Thorncliffe herds in Saskatchewan. Newbiggon Supreme was a senior herd sire for Dave and Pat Durie’s Duralta Shorthorns. At the Duralta Dispersal several herd sires were purchased in dam.  Some of these bulls were Bar C Supreme 6H used at Carter’s in BC. Duncairn Supreme and Scotsmorr Supreme 7H used in Saskatchewan. Sunalta Royal supreme 25H used at Dusty Valley in Alberta and Butterfield Krakatoa used at Butterfield’s in Alberta. Krakatoa is still seeing use AI across Canada.
One other line descending from Mandalong Super Flag again through Miami Flag 10G, Winalot Big Mac, Winalot Mighty Maxim then Butterfield’s F l’s Texas out of a Butterfield Krakatoa daughter. Texas’s two influential sons were T Bar Mactexas and Butterfield Able Seaman. Both of these bulls have descendants in Canada, USA, Great Britain, Ireland, New Zealand and Australia.

No doubt of importance and influence of Super Flag. My two better cows are S.Flag granddaughters. So will use it soon on ET.
Regarding Gus 80C and Big Mac, hear that both are by a Maine Anjou cow, so fake pedigrees  !! Any info about it?
:-\ :-\

 

[Okotoks]

Here is video of Mandalong Super Flag

http://www.browarny.com/legacy/video/clip27.html

There are several lines of bulls originating in Western Canada that descend in the paternal line from Manadalong Super Flag. Mandalong Super Flag was born in Australia in 1971 and imported to Canada in 1972 by Gary and Terry Carter, Newbiggon Shorthorns. Super Flag was a Grand Champion at the Denver  National Western Stock Show. In Canada Super Flag had a huge influence.
The one line was the Eionmor Ideals. They descend from Mandalong Super Flag through Miami Flag 10G, Winalot Big Mac, Lanalta Whiteout. Whiteout was the sire of the Ideals. The one son Eionmor Ideal 69F was a very well muscled bull. He in turn sired Muridale Buster 14K, Eionmor Ideal 4M, Eionmor Ideal 25M, Eionmor Ideal  61M and Eionmor Ideal 50P. Muridale Buster 14K sired Muridale Buster  2nd 76P plus innumerable others. 4M sired Six S Samson 25S and Six S Ranger 12R. Eionmor Ideal 50P was a senior sire at Eionmor and a son Eionmor Ideal 82T is now in service. The Buster and Ideal 61M are definitely calving ease lines.
Another sire line descending from Flag through Eionmor are the Eionmor Mr. Gus bulls. Flag sired Crowfoot Flag, sire of the Gafa Mochican bull used at Eionmor for several years. There he sired Eionmor Mr. Gus 30B, Eionmor Mr Gus 80C, Eionmor Mr Gus 85C, Eionmor Mr Gus 58F. The Eionmor Highlanders were sons of 80C. Another 80C son was Glenford Gus 4H in turn the sire of Star P Matrix a popular sire first at Butterfield’s and then at Horseshoe Creek and ACC Cattle in Saskatchewan. Also by 80C are Studers Pretender 96th and TM Gus 36S.
Still a third line was the Ultra line. Flag sired Crestdale Super Flag 14G a high selling bull at the Regina Bull sale. 14G sired Manitoba Sunrise used at Saskvalley and Huberdale.  A son of Manitoba Sunrise was Butterfield Ultramarine used at Eionmor where he sired Eionmor Ultra 8C the sire of Eionmor Ultra 88G. In turn 88G sired the likes of Alta Cedar Ultimate 130K used at Muridale and Evergreen and Alta cedar ultimate 8J used at Saskvalley.  One of 8J’s sons with huge impact is Saskvalley Navajo 153M now being used at Nick Steinke and Saskvalley Pioneer 126P a National Champion bull for Horseshoe Creek and Fantasy Lane with calves worldwide. This line is being carried on at Eionmor with senior herd sire Eionmor Ultra 4M.
Newbiggon Supreme was a son of Mandalong Super Flag, out of the imported Australian cow Mandalong Roany 51st. He was a twin born with Newbiggon Powerline used in the D’N Eden and Thorncliffe herds in Saskatchewan. Newbiggon Supreme was a senior herd sire for Dave and Pat Durie’s Duralta Shorthorns. At the Duralta Dispersal several herd sires were purchased in dam.  Some of these bulls were Bar C Supreme 6H used at Carter’s in BC. Duncairn Supreme and Scotsmorr Supreme 7H used in Saskatchewan. Sunalta Royal supreme 25H used at Dusty Valley in Alberta and Butterfield Krakatoa used at Butterfield’s in Alberta. Krakatoa is still seeing use AI across Canada.
One other line descending from Mandalong Super Flag again through Miami Flag 10G, Winalot Big Mac, Winalot Mighty Maxim then Butterfield’s F l’s Texas out of a Butterfield Krakatoa daughter. Texas’s two influential sons were T Bar Mactexas and Butterfield Able Seaman. Both of these bulls have descendants in Canada, USA, Great Britain, Ireland, New Zealand and Australia.

No doubt of importance and influence of Super Flag. My two better cows are S.Flag granddaughters. So will use it soon on ET.
Regarding Gus 80C and Big Mac, hear that both are by a Maine Anjou cow, so fake pedigrees   !! Any info about it?
:-\ :-\

I have never heard any rumours about Eionmor Mr. Gus 80C and am absolutely positive it is nothing more than a rumour. I was very familiar with the herd at that time and saw 80C shown as a calf, yearling and two year old. His sire Gafa Mohican was sired by Crowfoot Flag a son of Mandalong Super Flag and out of the Diamond Dottie 2nd cow. The dam's side is all old polled and beef genetics.

http://www.clrc.ca/cgi-bin/extended_pedigree.cgi?_breedcode=MS&_countrycode=&_regnumberprefix=M&_regnumber=464139&_regnumbersuffix=&_association=21

There is a rumour about the dam of Winalot Big Mac and some of the people that claim that never thought it important enough to report at the time ???

 

[Cabanha Santa Isabel - BR]

Here is video of Mandalong Super Flag

http://www.browarny.com/legacy/video/clip27.html

There are several lines of bulls originating in Western Canada that descend in the paternal line from Manadalong Super Flag. Mandalong Super Flag was born in Australia in 1971 and imported to Canada in 1972 by Gary and Terry Carter, Newbiggon Shorthorns. Super Flag was a Grand Champion at the Denver  National Western Stock Show. In Canada Super Flag had a huge influence.
The one line was the Eionmor Ideals. They descend from Mandalong Super Flag through Miami Flag 10G, Winalot Big Mac, Lanalta Whiteout. Whiteout was the sire of the Ideals. The one son Eionmor Ideal 69F was a very well muscled bull. He in turn sired Muridale Buster 14K, Eionmor Ideal 4M, Eionmor Ideal 25M, Eionmor Ideal  61M and Eionmor Ideal 50P. Muridale Buster 14K sired Muridale Buster  2nd 76P plus innumerable others. 4M sired Six S Samson 25S and Six S Ranger 12R. Eionmor Ideal 50P was a senior sire at Eionmor and a son Eionmor Ideal 82T is now in service. The Buster and Ideal 61M are definitely calving ease lines.
Another sire line descending from Flag through Eionmor are the Eionmor Mr. Gus bulls. Flag sired Crowfoot Flag, sire of the Gafa Mochican bull used at Eionmor for several years. There he sired Eionmor Mr. Gus 30B, Eionmor Mr Gus 80C, Eionmor Mr Gus 85C, Eionmor Mr Gus 58F. The Eionmor Highlanders were sons of 80C. Another 80C son was Glenford Gus 4H in turn the sire of Star P Matrix a popular sire first at Butterfield’s and then at Horseshoe Creek and ACC Cattle in Saskatchewan. Also by 80C are Studers Pretender 96th and TM Gus 36S.
Still a third line was the Ultra line. Flag sired Crestdale Super Flag 14G a high selling bull at the Regina Bull sale. 14G sired Manitoba Sunrise used at Saskvalley and Huberdale.  A son of Manitoba Sunrise was Butterfield Ultramarine used at Eionmor where he sired Eionmor Ultra 8C the sire of Eionmor Ultra 88G. In turn 88G sired the likes of Alta Cedar Ultimate 130K used at Muridale and Evergreen and Alta cedar ultimate 8J used at Saskvalley.  One of 8J’s sons with huge impact is Saskvalley Navajo 153M now being used at Nick Steinke and Saskvalley Pioneer 126P a National Champion bull for Horseshoe Creek and Fantasy Lane with calves worldwide. This line is being carried on at Eionmor with senior herd sire Eionmor Ultra 4M.
Newbiggon Supreme was a son of Mandalong Super Flag, out of the imported Australian cow Mandalong Roany 51st. He was a twin born with Newbiggon Powerline used in the D’N Eden and Thorncliffe herds in Saskatchewan. Newbiggon Supreme was a senior herd sire for Dave and Pat Durie’s Duralta Shorthorns. At the Duralta Dispersal several herd sires were purchased in dam.  Some of these bulls were Bar C Supreme 6H used at Carter’s in BC. Duncairn Supreme and Scotsmorr Supreme 7H used in Saskatchewan. Sunalta Royal supreme 25H used at Dusty Valley in Alberta and Butterfield Krakatoa used at Butterfield’s in Alberta. Krakatoa is still seeing use AI across Canada.
One other line descending from Mandalong Super Flag again through Miami Flag 10G, Winalot Big Mac, Winalot Mighty Maxim then Butterfield’s F l’s Texas out of a Butterfield Krakatoa daughter. Texas’s two influential sons were T Bar Mactexas and Butterfield Able Seaman. Both of these bulls have descendants in Canada, USA, Great Britain, Ireland, New Zealand and Australia.

No doubt of importance and influence of Super Flag. My two better cows are S.Flag granddaughters. So will use it soon on ET.
Regarding Gus 80C and Big Mac, hear that both are by a Maine Anjou cow, so fake pedigrees  !! Any info about it?
:-\ :-\

I have never heard any rumours about Eionmor Mr. Gus 80C and am absolutely positive it is nothing more than a rumour. I was very familiar with the herd at that time and saw 80C shown as a calf, yearling and two year old. His sire Gafa Mohican was sired by Crowfoot Flag a son of Mandalong Super Flag and out of the Diamond Dottie 2nd cow. The dam's side is all old poled and beef genetics.

http://www.clrc.ca/cgi-bin/extended_pedigree.cgi?_breedcode=MS&_countrycode=&_regnumberprefix=M&_regnumber=464139&_regnumbersuffix=&_association=21

There is a rumour abuot the dam of Winalot Big Mac and some of the people that claim that never thought it important enough to report at the time ???

Suppose that the rumor is about him be son of a Maine cow from Melbros herd!
Do you know some info about bulls that are not what pedigrees show? Can list it for me and what infusions are there!
(thumbsup)

 

[Okotoks]

Here is video of Mandalong Super Flag

http://www.browarny.com/legacy/video/clip27.html

There are several lines of bulls originating in Western Canada that descend in the paternal line from Manadalong Super Flag. Mandalong Super Flag was born in Australia in 1971 and imported to Canada in 1972 by Gary and Terry Carter, Newbiggon Shorthorns. Super Flag was a Grand Champion at the Denver  National Western Stock Show. In Canada Super Flag had a huge influence.
The one line was the Eionmor Ideals. They descend from Mandalong Super Flag through Miami Flag 10G, Winalot Big Mac, Lanalta Whiteout. Whiteout was the sire of the Ideals. The one son Eionmor Ideal 69F was a very well muscled bull. He in turn sired Muridale Buster 14K, Eionmor Ideal 4M, Eionmor Ideal 25M, Eionmor Ideal  61M and Eionmor Ideal 50P. Muridale Buster 14K sired Muridale Buster  2nd 76P plus innumerable others. 4M sired Six S Samson 25S and Six S Ranger 12R. Eionmor Ideal 50P was a senior sire at Eionmor and a son Eionmor Ideal 82T is now in service. The Buster and Ideal 61M are definitely calving ease lines.
Another sire line descending from Flag through Eionmor are the Eionmor Mr. Gus bulls. Flag sired Crowfoot Flag, sire of the Gafa Mochican bull used at Eionmor for several years. There he sired Eionmor Mr. Gus 30B, Eionmor Mr Gus 80C, Eionmor Mr Gus 85C, Eionmor Mr Gus 58F. The Eionmor Highlanders were sons of 80C. Another 80C son was Glenford Gus 4H in turn the sire of Star P Matrix a popular sire first at Butterfield’s and then at Horseshoe Creek and ACC Cattle in Saskatchewan. Also by 80C are Studers Pretender 96th and TM Gus 36S.
Still a third line was the Ultra line. Flag sired Crestdale Super Flag 14G a high selling bull at the Regina Bull sale. 14G sired Manitoba Sunrise used at Saskvalley and Huberdale.  A son of Manitoba Sunrise was Butterfield Ultramarine used at Eionmor where he sired Eionmor Ultra 8C the sire of Eionmor Ultra 88G. In turn 88G sired the likes of Alta Cedar Ultimate 130K used at Muridale and Evergreen and Alta cedar ultimate 8J used at Saskvalley.  One of 8J’s sons with huge impact is Saskvalley Navajo 153M now being used at Nick Steinke and Saskvalley Pioneer 126P a National Champion bull for Horseshoe Creek and Fantasy Lane with calves worldwide. This line is being carried on at Eionmor with senior herd sire Eionmor Ultra 4M.
Newbiggon Supreme was a son of Mandalong Super Flag, out of the imported Australian cow Mandalong Roany 51st. He was a twin born with Newbiggon Powerline used in the D’N Eden and Thorncliffe herds in Saskatchewan. Newbiggon Supreme was a senior herd sire for Dave and Pat Durie’s Duralta Shorthorns. At the Duralta Dispersal several herd sires were purchased in dam.  Some of these bulls were Bar C Supreme 6H used at Carter’s in BC. Duncairn Supreme and Scotsmorr Supreme 7H used in Saskatchewan. Sunalta Royal supreme 25H used at Dusty Valley in Alberta and Butterfield Krakatoa used at Butterfield’s in Alberta. Krakatoa is still seeing use AI across Canada.
One other line descending from Mandalong Super Flag again through Miami Flag 10G, Winalot Big Mac, Winalot Mighty Maxim then Butterfield’s F l’s Texas out of a Butterfield Krakatoa daughter. Texas’s two influential sons were T Bar Mactexas and Butterfield Able Seaman. Both of these bulls have descendants in Canada, USA, Great Britain, Ireland, New Zealand and Australia.

No doubt of importance and influence of Super Flag. My two better cows are S.Flag granddaughters. So will use it soon on ET.
Regarding Gus 80C and Big Mac, hear that both are by a Maine Anjou cow, so fake pedigrees  !! Any info about it?
:-\ :-\

I have never heard any rumours about Eionmor Mr. Gus 80C and am absolutely positive it is nothing more than a rumour. I was very familiar with the herd at that time and saw 80C shown as a calf, yearling and two year old. His sire Gafa Mohican was sired by Crowfoot Flag a son of Mandalong Super Flag and out of the Diamond Dottie 2nd cow. The dam's side is all old poled and beef genetics.

http://www.clrc.ca/cgi-bin/extended_pedigree.cgi?_breedcode=MS&_countrycode=&_regnumberprefix=M&_regnumber=464139&_regnumbersuffix=&_association=21

There is a rumour abuot the dam of Winalot Big Mac and some of the people that claim that never thought it important enough to report at the time ???

Suppose that the rumor is about him be son of a Maine cow from Melbros herd!
Do you know some info about bulls that are not what pedigrees show? Can list it for me and what infusions are there!
(thumbsup)

I have never heard anything about Maines and Melbros so really can't help you out there.

 

[coyote]

Is there any pictures of Gafa Mohican around. They say he was a real thick bull.

 

[Okotoks]

Is there any pictures of Gafa Mohican around. They say he was a real thick bull.

Here is a mature photo of him.

 

[RyanChandler]

Where would one go to obtain some straws of Deertrail Buckshot?  Love the name btw. Is he on the New York Times best selling book, "Shorty Heifer Bulls" by aj Allen Coe?

I doubt Buckshot weighed a ton when I saw him... are you sure??

I guess he would be another useless dud then. Bulls need to weigh 2400 plus. Thats the magic number Im learning.

I'd have to question the growth of a mature bull that didn't even weigh a ton.  He'll even pharo has frame 3 bulls that hit the ton mark.

 

[Okotoks]

Where would one go to obtain some straws of Deertrail Buckshot?  Love the name btw. Is he on the New York Times best selling book, "Shorty Heifer Bulls" by aj Allen Coe?

I doubt Buckshot weighed a ton when I saw him... are you sure??

I guess he would be another useless dud then. Bulls need to weigh 2400 plus. Thats the magic number Im learning.

I'd have to question the growth of a mature bull that didn't even weigh a ton.  He'll even pharo has frame 3 bulls that hit the ton mark.

I saw Buckshot as a mature bull at Shadybrook and he was well over a ton, I would have said at least 2300 or 2400 lbs. I always liked the bull and he left some good daughters and also sired Shadybrook Scotty.

 

[mark tenenbaum]

Im gonna use Mark 4 if I can get a retro bred female that goes back to rodeo (FHF Rodeos Hope-lowest BW Rodeo Ever) and either Byland Dazzler or GB Daybreak Express on the other side.I think Cody Ice had either Big Mac or a son at Louisville in 2002-HUGE-But the bulls with the Maine from up North that Ive really been invilved with 1 way or another are: Strathore Irish Magic, and Echodale Top Draft-Top Draft changed like a fullbloos-and they can change a Shorthorn faster than anything else Ive seen-for better or worse. O0

 

[justintime]

Im gonna use Mark 4 if I can get a retro bred female that goes back to rodeo (FHF Rodeos Hope-lowest BW Rodeo Ever) and either Byland Dazzler or GB Daybreak Express on the other side.I think Cody Ice had either Big Mac or a son at Louisville in 2002-HUGE-But the bulls with the Maine from up North that Ive really been invilved with 1 way or another are: Strathore Irish Magic, and Echodale Top Draft-Top Draft changed like a fullbloos-and they can change a Shorthorn faster than anything else Ive seen-for better or worse. O0

I would bet my farm that Echodale Top Draft does not have Maine in his pedigree, but if he does it would be from genetics back further in his pedigree than the Echodale herd. Reg Daly, who bred Top Draft, was as honest and down to earth breeder as I have ever known. He loved his Shorthorn cattle, and the only thing closer to his heart were his family. Reg passed away a few years ago, but I can still remember sitting at his kitchen table and discussing the breed. I can guarantee you that he had absolutely no time for anyone who bred bogus cattle to try to get ahead. He was a master feeder and he raised his family from a few Shorthorn cows on a tiny farm in Quebec.

As for Irish Magic, I have oftentimes wondered about his heritage. I just happened to be at Strathore the day he was born. He was an amazing looking calf and he was not quite dry yet when Lorne Pimmett took us out to see the new calf that had been born a few hours before. His dam was a powerful female, and to me, she appeared to look like she could have been a half blood Maine, but I have absolutely no proof. I remember making the comment to a friend travelling with me, that she looked a lot like the Capone half bloods we had at home.  I am not going to start naming other bulls and/or bloodlines that could possibly be suspect. Many breeders have put their faith and investments into buying some of these genetics and I don't think it is really proper to bash them on a public forum.

 

[Cabanha Santa Isabel - BR]

If I were one of those breeders who put money, time and hope on these animals that I supposed to be what their pedigrees said, I really would like very much to know the truth about these genetic errors caused by other breeders. Of course that on the first moment will to be disappointed, but relevant information are always welcome.

I prefer to discover the truth in skilful time to save some important and rare semen than finding out later, wasting rare and expensive genetics because I was not informed in akilful time to avoid increased costs on these animals.

If the breeder is in his goal these genetic selection program, he will look for new options in time to not lost your full work.

For this reason, always ask the north american fellows of this group for informations about bulls or cows that were overlooked genetically through falsified pedigrees.

Truth before all!

 

[Cabanha Santa Isabel - BR]

Here is video of Mandalong Super Flag

http://www.browarny.com/legacy/video/clip27.html

There are several lines of bulls originating in Western Canada that descend in the paternal line from Manadalong Super Flag. Mandalong Super Flag was born in Australia in 1971 and imported to Canada in 1972 by Gary and Terry Carter, Newbiggon Shorthorns. Super Flag was a Grand Champion at the Denver  National Western Stock Show. In Canada Super Flag had a huge influence.
The one line was the Eionmor Ideals. They descend from Mandalong Super Flag through Miami Flag 10G, Winalot Big Mac, Lanalta Whiteout. Whiteout was the sire of the Ideals. The one son Eionmor Ideal 69F was a very well muscled bull. He in turn sired Muridale Buster 14K, Eionmor Ideal 4M, Eionmor Ideal 25M, Eionmor Ideal  61M and Eionmor Ideal 50P. Muridale Buster 14K sired Muridale Buster  2nd 76P plus innumerable others. 4M sired Six S Samson 25S and Six S Ranger 12R. Eionmor Ideal 50P was a senior sire at Eionmor and a son Eionmor Ideal 82T is now in service. The Buster and Ideal 61M are definitely calving ease lines.
Another sire line descending from Flag through Eionmor are the Eionmor Mr. Gus bulls. Flag sired Crowfoot Flag, sire of the Gafa Mochican bull used at Eionmor for several years. There he sired Eionmor Mr. Gus 30B, Eionmor Mr Gus 80C, Eionmor Mr Gus 85C, Eionmor Mr Gus 58F. The Eionmor Highlanders were sons of 80C. Another 80C son was Glenford Gus 4H in turn the sire of Star P Matrix a popular sire first at Butterfield’s and then at Horseshoe Creek and ACC Cattle in Saskatchewan. Also by 80C are Studers Pretender 96th and TM Gus 36S.
Still a third line was the Ultra line. Flag sired Crestdale Super Flag 14G a high selling bull at the Regina Bull sale. 14G sired Manitoba Sunrise used at Saskvalley and Huberdale.  A son of Manitoba Sunrise was Butterfield Ultramarine used at Eionmor where he sired Eionmor Ultra 8C the sire of Eionmor Ultra 88G. In turn 88G sired the likes of Alta Cedar Ultimate 130K used at Muridale and Evergreen and Alta cedar ultimate 8J used at Saskvalley.  One of 8J’s sons with huge impact is Saskvalley Navajo 153M now being used at Nick Steinke and Saskvalley Pioneer 126P a National Champion bull for Horseshoe Creek and Fantasy Lane with calves worldwide. This line is being carried on at Eionmor with senior herd sire Eionmor Ultra 4M.
Newbiggon Supreme was a son of Mandalong Super Flag, out of the imported Australian cow Mandalong Roany 51st. He was a twin born with Newbiggon Powerline used in the D’N Eden and Thorncliffe herds in Saskatchewan. Newbiggon Supreme was a senior herd sire for Dave and Pat Durie’s Duralta Shorthorns. At the Duralta Dispersal several herd sires were purchased in dam.  Some of these bulls were Bar C Supreme 6H used at Carter’s in BC. Duncairn Supreme and Scotsmorr Supreme 7H used in Saskatchewan. Sunalta Royal supreme 25H used at Dusty Valley in Alberta and Butterfield Krakatoa used at Butterfield’s in Alberta. Krakatoa is still seeing use AI across Canada.
One other line descending from Mandalong Super Flag again through Miami Flag 10G, Winalot Big Mac, Winalot Mighty Maxim then Butterfield’s F l’s Texas out of a Butterfield Krakatoa daughter. Texas’s two influential sons were T Bar Mactexas and Butterfield Able Seaman. Both of these bulls have descendants in Canada, USA, Great Britain, Ireland, New Zealand and Australia.

Do you have another link for this video. I tryed and isn't running! Wish copy it on my computer. Thanks you.

 

[Cabanha Santa Isabel - BR]

I just got my semen storage bill and was looking at my inventory. Some of the sires from the past we have stored are
Maplewood Drive Princeton
Scotsdale Karnwood
Miami Baron 20B
Weston Ablo
Four Point Royal 13th
Cactus Flat Winner 4W
Meriwong Royal Grant
Mandalong Royal Ferrari
Mandalong Super Flag
Newbiggon Jumbo
Newbiggon Super Star
Matlock Torpedo 49T
and a Banner Royal Oak but not sure which one until it's checked?
oh and there's still 4 straws of Ayatollah,the demand for this would be huge! ;D
That's all bulls born pre1987.
What do others have? Some breeds keep track of older bulls available.

Do you is able to sale some embryos sired by these awesome bulls?

 

[justintime]

If I were one of those breeders who put money, time and hope on these animals that I supposed to be what their pedigrees said, I really would like very much to know the truth about these genetic errors caused by other breeders. Of course that on the first moment will to be disappointed, but relevant information are always welcome.

I prefer to discover the truth in skilful time to save some important and rare semen than finding out later, wasting rare and expensive genetics because I was not informed in akilful time to avoid increased costs on these animals.

If the breeder is in his goal these genetic selection program, he will look for new options in time to not lost your full work.

For this reason, always ask the north american fellows of this group for informations about bulls or cows that were overlooked genetically through falsified pedigrees.

Truth before all!

I do not think it is proper to discuss possibilities about corrupt pedigrees in any breed, that a person cannot prove without any doubt. I can think of many sires over the years, from several different breeds, that I questioned their heritage. I can't prove that anything was added to their genetic make-up so if it is just " assumed" it is nothing but rumour and could be totally wrong. I think a conversation to take place between two people is a different issue than public bashing, without the ability to prove your assumptions, on a public board like this.

If I didn't feel this was the case, I could go on for a long time about many different lines in several different breeds. I do think it is harder to play with pedigrees than it was prior to DNA. I think mistakes can still be make and we see several every year from animals that do not parentage test by DNA. Many of these can be explained but a few never do get figured out.

In the past, some breeders were pretty bold in fudging pedigrees. I remember a friend going to help one of his neighbor's ( who was a well known Polled Hereford breeder) catch up with the paperwork of registering about 300 calves. Shortly after they got started at this task, my friend asked for the sire of a particular calf. The owner's response was " What bulls are really popular right now?" My friend said this guy was totally serious and he said it didn't take very long to figure out that he wasn't going to help him any longer.