The Red Angus Post

[ROAD WARRIOR]

Interesting - guess all of the ones I've seen on the show road were black. What frame score/ measurement qualifies as lowline? I know very little about them.

 

[shortyjock89]

I've never seen a Red Lowline in person, but I imagine that they are just like a "standard" Lowline, if there is such a thing.  I don't know what they used for a standard when they developed the breed. As I understand it, they breed happened by accident, well kind of anyhow.  An Australian study bred small cows together, and bred large cows together, and then bred moderate cows together.  I think they wanted to see if performance was directly influenced by frame score.  It is, of course, and thus the birth of the Lowline.  I probably butchered that story, and TJ could tell it much better than I .  I do know that you can register percentage Lowlines.  You could breed a Lowline to a Shorthorn and end up with a Registered App. Shorthorn and a 1/2 Blood Lowline.  Lowlines can be utilized as calving ease sires, they add muscle and also correctness.  They are a useful cross with some bigger, rangier cows to create moderately framed show calves, replacement females, or terminal market animals. 

 

[ROAD WARRIOR]

I have read about the Austrailian study that founded the breed but that is pretty much where my knowledge of them ends.

 

[shortyjock89]

http://www.usa-lowline.org/  

that site is very useful in finding info on Lowlines.  If you can't find it on there, TJ knows pretty much everything on them lol.  

 

[red]

I was going to ask him the size of the calves he posted in the contest. Some looked really nice. Wasn't sure how big they actually were.
Hey TJ, got some Lowline questions for you!

Red

 

[TJ]

TJ - How is the cow pictured bred?

The 4 great-grandsires are... BHC Stryker,  BJR C Cheif 816,  JRA Wrangler 999  &  Angels 710.  I don't know a thing about any of them... are they any count?  On paper, she's the worst EPD Red Angus female that I've got (BW is a 0.6 though), but I don't pay too much attention to EPD's. 

 

[TJ]

TJ -  Is there a recessive red gene in the lowlines to produce red calves? I guess if not there will be in about 8 weeks.

Yes, but very few of the fullbloods have it.  Furthermore, almost nobody has tested for it until recently.   There is only 1 Red Fullblood Lowline bull in the USA & he actually carries the wild gene, not the recessive red gene.  However, some black animals in the USA have been identified as carrying the red gene.  I am now kicking myself, because I think that I sold a fullblood bull that is a red gene carrier!!

All in all, I only know of maybe 3 red fullblood Lowline bulls in the USA or Australia & I only know of less than 10 percentage red Lowline bulls in the USA.   

All Lowlines are pretty expesive, but like Shortyjock said (who did a good job explaining Lowlines), these red Lowlines are out of sight.  A red Fullblood cow in Australia sold for $25,000 (US funds).  Embryos out of a Red Fullblood cow & Red Fullblood bull are being sodl in the USA for $5,000.  That is too pricey for my blood, so unless I can find a good deal, I am going to go the percentage route.   

 

[TJ]

Interesting - guess all of the ones I've seen on the show road were black. What frame score/ measurement qualifies as lowline? I know very little about them.

I know that at least 1 Red percentage Lowline bull was shown at Denver the past 2 years & another one made the trip to Denver this past year, but they are rare.  Also, 1 or 2 out reds of 200 total Lowlines at Denver would be real easy to miss.   

Lowlines don't have a set frame score.  However, it is "recommended" that they fall into a certain range, but the only actual requirement for a fullblood is that they have to be DNA parent verified to trace back the Trangie herd in Australia... that's it.  Doc Holliday is 48.5 inches @ 3.5 years. 

Also, like shortyjock said, the Lowlines have a seperate percentage registry, which is very similar to the app. shorthorn & an animal could be registered as both.  I've got some F1's  that are dual registered as 1/2 Tarentaise in the ATA & 1/2 Lowline in the ALR.   Thye can be bred up to 7/8 & at that point they are considered "purebreds".  However, a percentage Lowline can never become a fullblood. 

 

[TJ]

I was going to ask him the size of the calves he posted in the contest. Some looked really nice. Wasn't sure how big they actually were.
Hey TJ, got some Lowline questions for you!

Red

Without weighing them it is tough to guess.  The fullblood bull is probably pushing close to 300 lbs. @ 4 months. 
The fullblood heifers are all 3-4 months & I'd guess them to range from 200-250 lbs.

I'll probably get them weighed within the next few weeks & I will be sure to let you know. 
   
         

 

[shortyjock89]

Well...looks like I didn't do a horrible job of explaining a couple things lol.  It's just because you told it all to me before. Thanks TJ!

 

[TJ]

Well...looks like I didn't do a horrible job of explaining a couple things lol.  It's just because you told it all to me before. Thanks TJ!

You did a good job  & thanks for answering the questions! 

 

[OH Breeder]

The more you post pictures, the more interested I am becoming in the Lowlines. I am a big fan of Red cattle. Red Lowlines would be nice. I am going to check the site out Shortyjock left.
Thanks TJ for all your information. You are a valuable resource. (clapping)

 

[ROAD WARRIOR]

TJ - How is the cow pictured bred?

The 4 great-grandsires are... BHC Stryker,   BJR C Cheif 816,   JRA Wrangler 999   &   Angels 710.   I don't know a thing about any of them... are they any count?  On paper, she's the worst EPD Red Angus female that I've got (BW is a 0.6 though), but I don't pay too much attention to EPD's. 

Stryker was a fairly dominant show bull some years ago, he was sired by National CH bull Wheel O fortune and was I think the bull that helped kick off Brylor semen sales. C Chief 816 was a calving ease sire from Boot Jack Ranch, Alot of the C Chief cattle were extreme light BW and EPD - at one time C Chief 811 was a -7 something BW EPD but the rest of their numbers were pretty flat. Wrangler came from the James herd, one of the oldest if not the oldest herds in Iowa. If memory serves me correctly he was champion bull at at least Iowa State fair and maybe the NAILE in the late 80's or early 90's. I don't have any specific knowledge of the Angels 710 bull but most of the Angels cattle were calving ease bred. the udder quality issue for your cow probably traces back at least in part to the Stryker bull.

 

[TJ]

The more you post pictures, the more interested I am becoming in the Lowlines. I am a big fan of Red cattle. Red Lowlines would be nice. I am going to check the site out Shortyjock left.
Thanks TJ for all your information. You are a valuable resource. (clapping)

Thank you!! 

You might find more useful info on the Australian website...

http://lowline.une.edu.au/

Sadly, not much to found on either site about red Lowlines.  FWIW, I am currently trying to obtain a semen interest in a red gene carrier fullblood Lowline bull. 

 

[TJ]

TJ - How is the cow pictured bred?

The 4 great-grandsires are... BHC Stryker,   BJR C Cheif 816,   JRA Wrangler 999   &   Angels 710.   I don't know a thing about any of them... are they any count?  On paper, she's the worst EPD Red Angus female that I've got (BW is a 0.6 though), but I don't pay too much attention to EPD's. 

Stryker was a fairly dominant show bull some years ago, he was sired by National CH bull Wheel O fortune and was I think the bull that helped kick off Brylor semen sales. C Chief 816 was a calving ease sire from Boot Jack Ranch, Alot of the C Chief cattle were extreme light BW and EPD - at one time C Chief 811 was a -7 something BW EPD but the rest of their numbers were pretty flat. Wrangler came from the James herd, one of the oldest if not the oldest herds in Iowa. If memory serves me correctly he was champion bull at at least Iowa State fair and maybe the NAILE in the late 80's or early 90's. I don't have any specific knowledge of the Angels 710 bull but most of the Angels cattle were calving ease bred. the udder quality issue for your cow probably traces back at least in part to the Stryker bull.

Thanks, that is good info for me to know!  (clapping)

Do you know much about, AHE Royal Pride 48  (AHE Jay 743 X AHE Pride Lady 825)  &/or  Hilliard 914?   

 

[ROAD WARRIOR]

Royale pride came from the Al Emphinger herd. Very performance and maternal oriented herd. I used a half brother to him several years ago, lots of growth and power but quite a bit of birth too. Sorry don't know much about Hillard 914.

 

[TJ]

Royale pride came from the Al Emphinger herd. Very performance and maternal oriented herd. I used a half brother to him several years ago, lots of growth and power but quite a bit of birth too. Sorry don't know much about Hillard 914.

Thanks again!  I am sure that Hillard 914 is probably some small outfit's herd/clean up bull or something like that.  I've got a couple of females with these genetics & they look a little more feminine than the cow that I posted the pic of & potentially look to be better uddered too. 

 

[Show Dad]

A few years ago I was at perks sale and saw some pretty good cubs there. I think he kind of follows the pattern of the cow as far as what he produces from what I have seen.
S D- How was the heifers dam bred ?

RW - AI'd from a son.

I got the funniest reply from the guy. He was all excited about showing the cattle to me but when I asked how the dam was bred, he got tight with the info. His answer was in response to my leading question. So take it for what it's worth. Maybe he was afraid I'd steal his new recipe for a good heifer. I would much rather buy from a local breeder for a lot of reasons. But some are so paranoid they won't hardly give out any information on their cattle. So much so that I will travel a distance because a breeder has gained my trust through giving me as much information as I want. Sad but true.

 

[DL]

A few years ago I was at perks sale and saw some pretty good cubs there. I think he kind of follows the pattern of the cow as far as what he produces from what I have seen.
S D- How was the heifers dam bred ?

RW - AI'd from a son.

I got the funniest reply from the guy. He was all excited about showing the cattle to me but when I asked he got tight with the info. His answer was in response to my leading question. So take it for what it's worth. Maybe he was afraid I'd still his new recipe for a good heifer. I would much rather buy from a local breeder for a lot of reasons. But some are so paranoid they won't hardly give out any information on their cattle. So much so that I will travel a distance because a breeder has gain my trust through giving me as much information as I want. Sad but true.

OK - I'm confused SD - are you saying that breeders won't show you their calves and give you info about their cows? That is certainly a bizarre way to promote a program....

 

[Show Dad]

DL - Sorry for the confusion. :-\

He showed me the calves but got really guarded with the information on how he got there. I've seen this before with a few breeders. It's like they know the secret of the Holy Grail, want you to know they know, but don't want to give out any details.