Very disgusting day yesterday

[inthebarnagain]

I had a local buyer for the cryptorchid steer that I had posted on here about.  Called the closest large animal vet around that mostly does horse stuff but has on the occasion came through for us to come anesthetise him and castrate him.  Unfortunately the testicle was nowhere to be found so he was just going to have to be someones dinner next year.  But then the real icing on the cake happened, the calf died!!  In hindsight, and after googling dosage on xylazine in cattle I would say he got about twice the dose he should have had and then chased it with ketamine. 

When my 11 year old went out of the barn crying I almost felt sorry for the vet, I could tell he felt like a heel but geez!!!  If you say you can do something for a client, AT LEAST MAKE SURE YOU KNOW WHAT YOU ARE DOING!!!!

Days like this that make you want to sell every stinking cow you own. 

 

[the angus111]

its going to get worse,we need more large animal vets and kids rather go to the city and doctor dogs, parrots and cats for more money.I hope there are young people on SP that have dreams of being large animal vets and succeed.my knabe spelling disclaimer is in place.rusty

 

[showsteerdlux]

its going to get worse,we need more large animal vets and kids rather go to the city and doctor dogs, parrots and cats for more money.I hope there are young people on SP that have dreams of being large animal vets and succeed.my knabe spelling disclaimer is in place.rusty

I had hopes of going to vet school when I cam to college, but the requirements to go are ridiculous (think just as much biology and chemistry as pre-med, plus physics and all these other wonderful classes), and on top of that we are competing with the small animal people to get a spot.

 

[Jill]

Even with all of the required class work you just about have to know someone to even have a chance at getting into vet school.  We need large vets, but I can understand when you have to support a family it's hard to make the decision to go into a large pratice when you know it is a lot more work and a quarter of the pay.

 

[carl s.]

All sorts of contraditions here…

You just made sure that you have access to one less vet for cattle.  Working outside your core competency isn’t fun in the first place and the risk of getting bit in the ass doing somebody a favor is why it’s not typically done.

As soon as cattlemen stop griping about spending one penny on a vet (in comparison to city dog owners who will mortgage the house for their dog) you’ll see the demand curve change.

The thread starts with a complaint about a vet making a mistake and the second reply is a complaint that it’s too hard to become a vet.  Lowering the bar isn’t going to improve the quality of vet care.

 

[JWW]

i am currently in my second year of vet school, i do have ambitions of food animal medicine (especially beef cow/calf), as for the comments of about the prerequisites for vet school being out of control. HA! it only prepares you for what it is like. remember than one real hard science class you had that one semester? well in vet school you have 20 credit hours of it. yeah it is alot of basic science to get in (who really like organic chemistry anyway?), the real shame is the lack of required animal science courses required. only 1 class- undergraduate anatomy/physiology is required.

JWW

 

[Jill]

I don't remember saying anything about lowering the bar, a vet license requires as much knowledge as a medical degree, the classes required are for a reason.  
People generally spend more on their dogs because they are a family pet, not because they are a dog, most people own cattle to make a profit and not as a pet, if you can't be profitable you may as well get out of the business, if you spent as much on cattle as most spend on the family pet you wouldn't need a large vet because you couldn't afford to keep the cattle.

 

[knabe]

there must be some stupid reason for organic chemistry like understanding chemical structure so that when you make a prescription, you know how it works, what it is incompatible with and all sorts of other useless stuff.  physical chemistry for understanding why DMSO is not trivial, physics i can understand some complaints, but it is probably, other than genetics, the sifter courses. 

 

[ghostrider]

Some animals just can't take the anasthetic, at any dosage. I wouldn't be in such a hurry to blame the vet - often what is recommended and what works in the real world are quite different.

I am sorry you lost the calf.  It really stinks when everyone has tried their hardest to do the right thing and it still goes wrong, but it just happens sometimes.

 

[carl s.]

Jill, you weren't the second reply to the thread.

 

[knabe]

Some animals just can't take the anasthetic, at any dosage. I wouldn't be in such a hurry to blame the vet - often what is recommended and what works in the real world are quite different.

good point.  that's why there will be personalized medicine as the low hanging fruit has been picked.  grand slams are rarely used as business models anymore.

 

[showsteerdlux]

Jill, you weren't the second reply to the thread.

I was the 2nd reply. On that note, I made a comment not a complaint, and in regards to your 1st reply, I never mentioned lowering the standards. I currently am 18 and in 2 weeks will have 70 hrs completed, with a current GPA of 3.697 and that will go up in 2 weeks, and I have already met the requirements to graduate with Honors as long as I keep a high GPA. Unless I'm mistaken, that isn't a GPA that would push lower standards. Unless you have been in the Pre-Vet program I don't think its fair to make those kinds of comments.
In response to JWW, I know that this is just a preparation and I agree totally that its a shame that more ANS classes are not required.

 

[DL]

People who can not do the prerequisit work for vet school will not survive the rigors of vet school

People who struggle mightly in vet school often do not pass the boards

The education for veterinary students is much broader (and therefore often less in depth) than that for medical students -  veterinary students are expected to be able to practice right out of school; most states require a minimum of an internship after medical school to get a license; most physicians have a residency on top of the internship

Vet school is extremely hard and time consuming for most people - the breadth of knowledge required is mind boggling

Some people spend more money on their dogs, some don't. Some people with elite bulls spend huge amounts on these bulls

Some schools (Iowa, MSU probably others) are starting to actively recruit ANS students with a farm animal background /interest while they are in undergrad

The average starting salary for food animal vets is comparable to other species - the big deal is the average $100,000 debt vet students have

Maybe he got too much xylazine, maybe he didn't - did you post him? Did he bleed to death? die from blaot because he wasn't kept sternal?

Just because you didn't get the results you wanted doesn't mean it was the vets fault - doesn't mean it wasn't - every time you anesthetize anything there is risk, every time you do surgery there is risk - sometimes it is nobody's fault - it just is

sorry about your calf

 

[carl s.]

but the requirements to go are ridiculous

If you don't want them to lower the bar, what is ridiculous about them?

 

[showsteerdlux]

but the requirements to go are ridiculous

If you don't want them to lower the bar, what is ridiculous about them?

Explain to me then why a 4.0 GPA after Quantitative Chemistry, Organic I and II, Physics I and II, Biochemistry, and Microbiology is not ridiculous. I am not some little punk who just wanted to "be a vet". I worked my tail off through HS, have a full academic scholarship to a very well known school on the east coast, and now am faced with the fact that because I don't have a 4.0 after these chemistry's, chances are I won't be going to vet school. I come from an ag background, and want to do everything possible to stay in agriculture.
I'm sorry if you can't see what I'm saying, but try going through this program, and I don't think you'll have the same ideas and criticisms.

 

[DL]

but the requirements to go are ridiculous

If you don't want them to lower the bar, what is ridiculous about them?

Explain to me then why a 4.0 GPA after Quantitative Chemistry, Organic I and II, Physics I and II, Biochemistry, and Microbiology is not ridiculous. I am not some little punk who just wanted to "be a vet". I worked my tail off through HS, have a full academic scholarship to a very well known school on the east coast, and now am faced with the fact that because I don't have a 4.0 after these chemistry's, chances are I won't be going to vet school. I come from an ag background, and want to do everything possible to stay in agriculture.
I'm sorry if you can't see what I'm saying, but try going through this program, and I don't think you'll have the same ideas and criticisms.

You don't need a 4.0 - you need to be able to show that you can do the work. You need good GRE scored - most schools weigh things - ie later science credits are more important than earlier - if your first term was a bust but all the rest were great it show you can do the work - if you want to go to vet school investigate the various programs, talk to the admissions office and figure out what you need to do to get it - part of the prerequisits are hoops to jump -tuition covers only a portion of your education - states spend a huge amount on educating vet students - they want to admit people who will succeed - pm me if you have questions

often times the people who complain the most about the requirements are those who didn't get in, couldn't get in or thought they were entitled and it should be easy - the requirements may not be perfect but it is all we have now - if ya wanna play the game you have to jump the hoops - hoop jumping often is used to cull those who have not made the committment

 

[carl s.]

You are trying to have your cake and eat it too.  In one reply you claim you don't want the standards lowered but in the next you complain that the standards are too high.

Are you okay with the requirements to become a vet or do you want them to be lowered for people such as yourself?

I wanted to go the vet route but realized early on that I simply did not have the work ethic required to compete with the people I'd have to in order to succeed and I chose a different route.  I DID NOT claim the program was the problem or that the requirements were ridiculous, I realized that the problem was myself.  It would have been extremely arrogant for me to claim I knew enough about a program I was not qualified for to pass judgement on the requirements they have chosen.

 

[simtal]

You need good GRE scored - most schools weigh things - ie later science credits are more important than earlier

The GRE, the stupidest standardized test ever dreamed of. Even worst than the ACT (another bogus test).

I know of several people who didn't make it into vet school and became MD's instead.

Another option is to go to grad school (make money, and no debt) and end up with good earning potential.

 

[vc]

A Friend of mine served in the Airforce right after high school, he attended colledge during the day and had night duty. When he got out of the Airforce he applied and was accepted at UC Davis. He purposely pursued and became a large animal vet specializing in Cattle. When asked why he did not want to be a small animal vet or purse the equine side of veterinary practice he said " I can work with and know what a dairymen or cattlemen expect from me. pet owners (horse owners included) are a pain in the --- to work with, I would rather enjoy what I do than hate what I do and make more money". He has been at it for 15 years now and still has the same feeling about it.

 

[knabe]

2nd round applications have a good acceptance rate from what i remember.

you don't just have one chance.

also, from what i remember, cal poly had a better acceptance rate to davis than davis students to vet school when i was in school.

some things are just based on determination.  keep plugging away.