what do you think?

[Lucky_P]

Good looking!

The Jordans wanted some idea how Orion 2047would work in a commercial herd and recruited us to do a progeny-test breeding trial, comparing Orion to his mgs, Coppertop 464, whom we'd been using (and liking!) on our cows for several years.
Test bred a group of mostly 3-6 y.o. 75-86% AN cows, bred up from Fleckvieh-influenced SimAngus base, to both bulls.  Cows were all daughters of AAA 12557724(N Bar Prime Time D806) or the walking herdsire AAA 15138281.

Calved out in Mar. 2014.  Best group of calves we've ever produced, hands-down!
BWs on calves (bulls & heifers) by both bulls averaged ~96# - heavier than what we usually see, but it was the coldest winter we'd had in 20 years, and we'd had to feed extra DDG through the winter due to horrible hay quality.  Other than one calf with an elbow back, no dystocias - and he came easily once I got his leg pulled forward.

Orion-sired steers weaned @ 7 months averaged 694#, no creep, just grass & mama's milk.
Coppertop-sired steers weaned at the same age averaged 607# - but there was a twin, 550#, who pulled that average down (his heifer mate weaned @450).
Looking forward to seeing ADG & carcass info on this group of steers after they feed 'em out.

Kept two nice Orion heifers, and have a couple more born this fall from semen left over from the breeding trial.
If they'll agree to release semen for commercial use, we'd use him again, in a heartbeat.

 

[KFShorthorns]

Orion-sired steers weaned @ 7 months averaged 694#, no creep, just grass & mama's milk.
Coppertop-sired steers weaned at the same age averaged 607# - but there was a twin, 550#, who pulled that average down (his heifer mate weaned @450).
Looking forward to seeing ADG & carcass info on this group of steers after they feed 'em out.

Kept two nice Orion heifers, and have a couple more born this fall from semen left over from the breeding trial.
If they'll agree to release semen for commercial use, we'd use him again, in a heartbeat.

How many cows were bred to each each sire?

 

[Baldie Maker]

Semen is now available on Orion.

http://m.waukaru.net/sires/cattle-sires/detail/id/6082

 

[mark tenenbaum]

Good looking!

The Jordans wanted some idea how Orion 2047would work in a commercial herd and recruited us to do a progeny-test breeding trial, comparing Orion to his mgs, Coppertop 464, whom we'd been using (and liking!) on our cows for several years.
Test bred a group of mostly 3-6 y.o. 75-86% AN cows, bred up from Fleckvieh-influenced SimAngus base, to both bulls.  Cows were all daughters of AAA 12557724(N Bar Prime Time D806) or the walking herdsire AAA 15138281.

Calved out in Mar. 2014.  Best group of calves we've ever produced, hands-down!
BWs on calves (bulls & heifers) by both bulls averaged ~96# - heavier than what we usually see, but it was the coldest winter we'd had in 20 years, and we'd had to feed extra DDG through the winter due to horrible hay quality.  Other than one calf with an elbow back, no dystocias - and he came easily once I got his leg pulled forward.

Orion-sired steers weaned @ 7 months averaged 694#, no creep, just grass & mama's milk.
Coppertop-sired steers weaned at the same age averaged 607# - but there was a twin, 550#, who pulled that average down (his heifer mate weaned @450).
Looking forward to seeing ADG & carcass info on this group of steers after they feed 'em out.

Kept two nice Orion heifers, and have a couple more born this fall from semen left over from the breeding trial.
If they'll agree to release semen for commercial use, we'd use him again, in a heartbeat.////  <party> <party> <party> (thumbsup)- This is what the good Shorthorn bulls need to be doing-PROVING THE POINT THAT THEY ARE NOT JUST YARD ORNAMENTS-Im really glad you posted-and it certainely is refreshing to see the breed actually being used somewhere-instead of being hidden through bullsh*^&^%#t syndications where there is no true playing field-and numerous "$100000" etc bulls end up with less than 30 calves registered and way less actually seen because all they really exist for are as paper trades. I rarely if ever see Shorthorn blood in commercial cattle along the road anymore-and I travel alot. O0

 

[knabe]

both bulls nice.

why are there black cows?

 

[mark tenenbaum]

both bulls nice.

why are there black cows?/// To get bred by white and roan bulls O0

 

[Lucky_P]

KF,
Spring-calving herd here has half the cow numbers of the fall group, but Toby wanted spring-born calves. High-percentage Simmental cows were dedicated to breeding to SM bulls, and farm manager(my wife) was not willing to back off on those.

So... the two Shorthorn sires were each mated to 7 cows, with 6 in each sire group calving to AI service - and we tried to equalize the deck as much as possible by breeding each sire to cows of similar age, percentage of Angus influence, and dam's sire. 
Ended up with 4 steers by each sire.
Coppertop calves were good, Orions were better.

Have used several other Shorthorn sires over high-percentage Angus cows over the last 5-6 years, and have been mostly very pleased with the results. 
Again, Spring 2014 calves were the best we've ever raised.

Went into the Shorthorn foray with the idea of creating a good base of SHxAN cows to breed to black Simmental sires for 'terminal' feeder calf production.  All my Shorthorn-cross cows/heifers are still too young to get a really good read on how well they're gonna suit us, but the farm manager is rethinking that deal - the Shorthorns may be as good a 'terminal' sire as the Simmentals!

Mark - you might or might not recognize the Shorthorn influence if you drove by my place.  Over half the mature cow herd are red gene carriers, so we've been getting quite a few red calves - but mostly blacks, and, thanks to the Simmental color dilution gene from SM bulls used in the 1980s...quite a few brown calves(look like some Murray Grays that I've seen).  Most SH-sired calves have been solid color with very little white - but did get one Orion calf this fall that's got a LOT of chrome - but the dam probably carries the spotting gene.
We've stayed away from roans & rwm bulls, as the local market here prefers blacks...but I've had no pushback on the reds that we've marketed alongside their black contemporaries.

I'm convinced that if commercial herds used the right sort of Shorthorn bulls, that there'd be an explosion of demand for Shorthorn bulls for use in commercial herds. 

 

[mark tenenbaum]

Well I think first-The availability has not been there-coming from the right sources-Commercial guys dont seem to gravitate towards semen deals like SEK-where there are a number of very viable red Bulls. As well-it seems like some of the very viable bulls are more word of mouth with little or no exposure to semen cos etc. I think the Shorthorn Assoc. have forced the issue (and rightly so) by eliminating alot of EPDS-And the BW issue has become such an issue that people like Sullivan and the whole Red Reward deal are changing things out of necessity-even though his marketing is not at all geared to the small every day breeder,much less the commercial people-(another of many examples of why the breed gets more and more closed off from everyone but the "trading" few).You can see the Shorthorn phenotype immediately-even in a black animal-The point is-other than bulls like Capiche-who was widely used-they just dont seem to exist outside the currant microcosim compared to the everyday use of other breeds. There are rare instances like your use: and if you cant get semen that suits your program-to use WHEN YOU WANT TO-then you would do what I would do-Use a Simm or a Maine.etc.-NO IM NOT TALKING ABOUT CANADA-which is way ahead on thisossibly in part to more realistic markets for any good cattle. O0

 

[RyanChandler]

Nice bull. Took this picture of Orion last summer. He's a good bull.

What a good looking bull--  I've seen quite a few SH bulls over the last 3 years and Orion has to be at the very top as far as bulls that have a chance of appealing to the commercial cattlemen.  I hope to see his use continue to increase.