What will happen... N/C related

[knabe]

its the difference between a country being driven by capitalism ......and a county run over by it  ...
both sides "extremes"  offer nothing for the working folks...jbarl

capitalism offers starting your own business for the working folks.  by working folks, i assume you mean those willing to work and strive to excel.  for those not willing to work and not excel, no one should offer them anything.  for those unable to work or restricted from excelling for whatever reason, capitalism has offered more to them than ANY OTHER SYSTEM BY FAR.

exactly what is it that working folks should offer?  plenty has been offered and plenty refused.

we are not run over by capitalism.  we are run over by subsidies, excessive taxes to pay for subsidies etc, tax breaks, welfare that hasn't changed poverty levels ever, etc etc.  are you taking too much advantage of capitalism?

capitalism has NOTHING to do with subsidies and preferential treatment.

 

[JbarL]

its the difference between a country being driven by capitalism ......and a county run over by it  ...
both sides "extremes"  offer nothing for the working folks...jbarl

capitalism has NOTHING to do with subsidies and preferential treatment.

tax cuts for corporations and the top 2% arent subsidies??.....they are the same...it all comes out of the same pot...the one we keep filling up each pay period
preferential treament.....like the oppetunity to steal everones retirement money ( and then do it ) ......or the oppertunity to make 20 million dollars a year as a pharmacutical / insurance or  bank president ...bush and his gang blew it...if capitalism has nothing to do with subsidies and preferential treatment...hows come  capitalists  and capitalism cant exist without them??....   jbarl

 

[knabe]

tax cuts for corporations and the top 2% arent subsidies??yes, that's why i want to end preferences. one should be taxed on their revenue regardless of amount to level the playing field, not give preferential subsidy to scale.....they are the same...it all comes out of the same pot...the one we keep filling up each pay period.
preferential treament.....like the oppetunity to steal everones retirement money ( and then do it ) ......or the oppertunity to make 20 million dollars a year as a pharmacutica (if it's done without subsidies, it's ok.  you need to be consistent in your argument)l / insurance or  bank president ...bush and his gang blew it...if capitalism has nothing to do with subsidies and preferential treatment...hows come  capitalists  and capitalism cant exist without them??..It can and does and is harmed by it.  subsidies are nothing more than incremental socialism..   jbarl

people are mostly afraid of not subsidizing failure.  once again, this allows faster reallocation of resources, a population not afraid of retraining etc.

 

[JbarL]

tax cuts for corporations and the top 2% aren't subsidies??yes, that's why i want to end preferences. one should be taxed on their revenue regardless of amount to level the playing field, not give preferential subsidy to scale.....they are the same...it all comes out of the same pot...the one we keep filling up each pay period.
preferential treatment.....like the op petunity to steal everones retirement money ( and then do it ) ......or the opportunity to make 20 million dollars a year as a pharmaceutic (if it's done without subsidies, it's ok.  you need to be consistent in your argument)l / insurance or  bank president ...bush and his gang blew it...if capitalism has nothing to do with subsidies and preferential treatment...hows come  capitalists  and capitalism cant exist without them??..It can and does and is harmed by it.  subsidies are nothing more than incremental socialism..   jbarl

people are mostly afraid of not subsidizing failure.  once again, this allows faster reallocation of resources, a population not afraid of retraining etc.

what pharmacutical company pays 20/mil a year  to an employee that doesnt get "prescription drug subsidies"  from the governement .."for the ederly" ? ?   those subsidies monies alone are going to cover about 25% of the total cost of this reform bill.....a quarter of the total cost funded by money we already have..for things like subsidizing the pharmaceutical industry so someone can make 20 mill/ yr...i figure before its all over theres going to be alot more of those subsidies that are being wasted by others go by the way side as well.....most people never new how much of there tax money was going to these   and other companies  in the first place.....wasted money is wasted money..that's why its possible to do this without raising our taxes...that's why as folks begin to learn more about these subsidizes and how much of there tax money is being invested in these coporate salaries/ and programs as well.... then alot more will    agree that subsidizes are taxes and they will want to do away with them as well ...   at least with taxes you get an itemized bill for it ( thats the taxes ( and any new ones)  the tea parties are protesting isnt it??)...with subsidies and war debt...we just let the war bills pile up and "assume" we have enough money to pay for it ...and it seems " corporate" monies keep us from knowing  how or why they receive billions of our tax dollars a year.   maybe obama will end up being the leader you all are looking for at your  tea parties, as some more large amount of money start lining up ??..  [color=green  ][/color] faliuer of subsidizes is a faliure of taxes [/color] jbarl

 

[knabe]

at least with taxes you get an itemized bill for it ( thats the taxes ( and any new ones)  the tea parties are protesting isnt it??)...with subsidies and war debt...we just let the war bills pile up and "assume" we have enough money to pay for it ...and it seems " corporate" monies keep us from knowing  how or why they receive billions of our tax dollars a year.   maybe obama will end up being the leader you all are looking for at your  tea parties, as some more large amount of money start lining up ??..  [color=green  ][/color] faliuer of subsidizes is a faliure of taxes [/color] jbarl

you keep forgetting that if the government itemizes the bill they take a 30% cut, assume lifetime benefits for those that itemized the bill.  with corporations, you have to make a profit or the company goes out of business and leaves you with a government plan that costs you more, especially in unfunded liabilities, which if you do the math, is way more than you are worried about corporations making money, which they funnel back into the economy anyway, rather than remove it.  obama will never be the leader.  he will give subsidies to his buddies.  for some reason, you don't seem to understand that both the R & D's are simply trying to outbribe each other by seeing who can create either the largest number of teats or the biggest teats.  the failure of subsidies is not the failure of taxes, it's the failure of redistribution of wealth, socialism.

 

[JbarL]

at least with taxes you get an itemized bill for it ( thats the taxes ( and any new ones)  the tea parties are protesting isnt it??)...with subsidies and war debt...we just let the war bills pile up and "assume" we have enough money to pay for it ...and it seems " corporate" monies keep us from knowing  how or why they receive billions of our tax dollars a year.   maybe obama will end up being the leader you all are looking for at your  tea parties, as some more large amount of money start lining up ??..  [color=green  ][/color] faliuer of subsidizes is a faliure of taxes [/color] jbarl

you keep forgetting that if the government itemizes the bill they take a 30% cut, assume lifetime benefits for those that itemized the bill.  with corporations, you have to make a profit or the company goes out of business and leaves you with a government plan that costs you more, especially in unfunded liabilities, which if you do the math, is way more than you are worried about corporations making money, which they funnel back into the economy anyway, rather than remove it.  obama will never be the leader.  he will give subsidies to his buddies.  for some reason, you don't seem to understand that both the R & D's are simply trying to outbribe each other by seeing who can create either the largest number of teats or the biggest teats.  the failure of subsidies is not the failure of taxes, it's the failure of redistribution of wealth, socialism.

your wishes for a third party are right around the corner....tea  parties are probally  over now...  , and everone on the right that got duped the last 6 months with the propoganda are going to "drop out"... you cnat have a major political movement without "someone" in a party directing them with facts and an alternate policy....they could do alot better by filling up the streets of washinghton, but that takes a person "in charge" / and an agenda....they seem to have neither....if this country is good a t one thing its shutting the gate after the horses are out...this legislatation is going to p;ick up momentum and  the tea party folks who  find out more about subsidises and taxes are going to finally realize its not worth there efforts....and theres your new third party base....jbarl

 

[knabe]

you cnat have a major political movement without "someone" in a party directing them with facts and an alternate policy...

as soon as people figure out that reading is useful, the democrats and republicans are done. 

the beauty of the constitution was distributed power, not "someone" in charge. 

the need for "someone" in charge is so... dependent.

 

[JbarL]

you cnat have a major political movement without "someone" in a party directing them with facts and an alternate policy...

 

 

the need for "someone" in charge is so... dependent.

an indepenent party of your choice awaits you....shoot if you dont need  any direction, or someone to take charge yoiu might as well just stay where youi are....jbarl

 

[knabe]

you might as well just stay where youi are....jbarl

the problem is that the R's and D's are taking away liberty and teaching potential supporters dependency as a default position.

dependency equals tax breaks, subsidies, etc and they do nothing but raise the cost of entry, which has to be routinely lowered through more subsidies all the while adding to the cost of government for no reason.  it's counterintuitive not to help people that don't need help.

 

[JbarL]

you might as well just stay where youi are....jbarl

the problem is that the R's and D's are taking away liberty and teaching potential supporters dependency as a default position.

they taught em how to steal it away....now we can show them how to pay it back....checks and balances....horse is out.....jbarl