White Shorthorn Bulls

[Okotoks]

I wanted to say why I think white shorthorn bulls have a roll to play in the shorthorn breed. The following is a quote from a recent topic and I thought we should just confess and get it out of the way right at the start of the topic!
"The truth.....don't you just love these little orchestrated attempts of shameless self marketing and contrived advertisements. "But wait...theres more!"
So here's more..............

For several years I bred my cow herd so as to never get a white calf. All the white and roan cows were bred to red bulls as were most of the red cows. Then I saw Circle M Ghost Rider 10G, a white horned bull and he became a herd bull at both our place as well as Norvyk Shorthorns and later Six S Shorthorns. He left us some beautiful replacement females. They have the perfect udders, are easy fleshing and have excellent feet. Then came Eionmor Ideal 61M,a paternal brother to Buster a white polled son of Eionmor Ideal 69F, calving ease all the way, again daughters with great udders. We followed with Northern Legend 3N who after his first calf crop in Australia is already a weaning weight trait leader there.

 

[Okotoks]

The first photo is of a Circle M Ghost Rider 10G daughter, Frimley Kitty Clare 43K, photographed this morning several hours after calving at 11 years of age. The calf is a red polled Diamond Prophecy 21P.

The second photo is a two year old Northern Legend 3N daughter with her Diamond Prophecy 21P heifer calf. These two are actually red roans.9W is a full sister to Diamond Razzy Susan 2R, 2R had a son sell for $8000 in th recent Alta Cedar Showcase Sale. (Sorry it's that infomercial again)

 

[jaimiediamond]

I attached a couple more examples

Diamond Mystical Susan 30M sire Circle M Ghost Rider 10G who is pictured as a 8 year old last summer
Blueprint Purdy Susan 1P sire Eionmor Ideal 61M who is pictured as a 7 year old yesterday

 

[Okotoks]

Purdy Susan above is by Eionmor Ideal 61M and out of a Circle M Ghost Rider10G daughter.
Below is a photo of Mystical last Sunday as well as her two year old daughter, Newbiggon Winsome Susan 3W , a daughter of Northen Legend 3N. Her white heifer calf is by the Australian bull Mandalong Royal Ferrari.

 

[justintime]

Okotoks..... it doesn't matter how much success you are having or if these genetics are working for you and your customers... you are still wrong, wrong, wrong!!  Sorry , I just wanted to tell you this first before some others had a chance to do so. I'm sure they will add their comments as well!! 
PS- BTW, I am obviously doing everything wrong as well, as I have had some pretty good results from the genetics I got from you as well. Too back they were all just wrong, or  would be tempted to get some more from you!!

 

[jaimiediamond]

Okotoks..... it doesn't matter how much success you are having or if these genetics are working for you and your customers... you are still wrong, wrong, wrong!!  Sorry , I just wanted to tell you this first before some others had a chance to do so. I'm sure they will add their comments as well!!   
PS- BTW, I am obviously doing everything wrong as well, as I have had some pretty good results from the genetics I got from you as well. Too back they were all just wrong, or  would be tempted to get some more from you!!

In order to be right right right I think the only answer is to use a red angus bull, and forget about producing purebred Shorthorns.   <party>

 

[mark tenenbaum]

Those are some really good looking cows-I wish there were a way to streamline the use of some of these sires-I think there was a real moderate son out of one of those bulls-that maybe Uluru had? or maybe Clippty Clop, Drew a blank-but he was really on target. Particularly like the middle bull-seen him in many pedigrees-but not :in a picture. O0

 

[oakview]

Leader 21st is another white bull that obviously shouldn't have been used because of his color.  Never mind that he was the bull of his time in the late 60's and early 70's and still has an impact today.  There is just no place in the industry today for a white Shorthorn bull.  I'll try to post a picture of the one I just brought home later tonight.  I'm hoping that everyone else sees what a mistake it would be to use him. 

 

[Aussie]

Okotoks. A strong lineup of bulls what ever the colour. Nice cows to I really like the 9W hfr would look good at home.

 

[trevorgreycattleco]

Well since I am a member of the solid red cow mafia I must say, you canadian mafia folks got your feathers ruffled over nothin. I dont have to have a solid red calf, the dumbass buyers around me do. When your a small fish in a big pond, you do what you can to try and not get eaten so I prefer red bulls. Honestly, the longer I am in this gig, the less I give a flyin fart about color. What smart cattleman decided that better cattle are solid colored anyway?  I had a heifer the other day out of a solid red cow and a solid red bull. The calf has a ton of white on it belly and legs. I just smiled when I saw it. I will keep her for sure. My first bull ever was a red neck roan. The salebarn cured me of liking those calves for now. As I focus more and more on freezer beef, it is nice to not really care what color they are. As long as the person eating it smiles and I did it on minimal input, we all win. Show me a white bull that fits mt criteria and I will try him. hell, I will trade you for 329 semen and we can sample each others bulls. Those bulls pictured are good bulls I am sure. When you start saying 100 lb bw in the ol USA, you may as well tell the fat lady to start singing. Patrick Wall just wrote a article in the shorthorn country verifying this. Low bw with good growth wins the day here. Just the way it is for now.

Those are impressive cows as well. I dont want to fight, just discuss this.  <beer>

 

[thunderdownunder]

Wow guys, that 9W has really gone on, love her! Just thought I'd share a pic of her from when I visited (I have more 3N daughter pics but I won't completely hijack this thread!)

 

[thunderdownunder]

Here's another 'wrong' purchase some Hereford guys made last month... they're gonna be ruined...
Top 1% 200 and 400 day weight, top 5% 600 day, carcase weight, eye muscle area, retail beef yield, SB3 carcase index, top 10% heavy domestic index

ETA- Weighed 1100kg at 2 years, with a 142 cm2 eye muscle area, 17mm and 13mm fat on the rump and ribs, and an ADG of 1.49kg/day.
Can't you just hear that money going down the drain?

 

[oakview]

Here's my mistake.  Hope he works.  Having trouble getting both pictures to fit.  2nd will follow.

 

[oakview]

Here's the second picture

 

[Doc]

Hey Lonnie & thunder, how are your bulls bred? They both look pretty good.

 

[OH Breeder]

These are little smaller might be easier to load.

 

[thunderdownunder]

Doc, here's my blokes pedigree: 

                THE GROVE INFORMANT U255 (P) Red BDBU255 
          THE GROVE LOCKYER X857 (P) Roan BDBX857 
                THE GROVE MILLICENT T354 (P) Roan 98X04115 
  Sire: YAMBURGAN LOCKYER 13TH (P) Roan YY A95 
                YAMBURGAN FOXER 27TH (P) Red 96X03715 
          YAMBURGAN CLOUDY 470TH (P) Red YY V83 
                YAMBURGAN CLOUDY 391ST (P) (TWIN) (APX) Roan 95A03641 
Animal: ESELAR PARK LOCK EASYPICK E028 (H) White RSLE028 
                MARELLAN VAGABOND (P) Red 94/04002 
          NAGOL PARK TAILOR-MADE (P) (AI) Red Little White 98X01950 
                NAGOL PARK ROMANCE R55 (P) (AI) Red Little White 96X02119 
  Dam: ESELAR PARK TAILOR HONOUR Z085 (P) Roan RSLZ085 
                BROUGHTON PARK MILLENIUM T22 (P) Red Little White 98X02992 
          ESELAR PARK Y2K HONOUR W15 (P) Roan RSLW015 
                NERO MINISTER'S HONOUR R65 (P) (AI) (SFA) Roan 96X02099 

 

[trevorgreycattleco]

How about a bw on your bloke tdu? I am a ol hillbilly, I have a hard time reading metric measurments. He looks preety good.
How about you oakview? Details? He looks like a hog. Good bull. Oh Lord does he have Trump in him? I may have to eat crow for saying good bull and its a Trump lol.

Lets all consign a few bulls we prefer to the National Western Sale and see what happens. Bring the white ones, roan ones, red ones, red and white ones. Let the customers decide. As far as the majority here is concerned 100 lb bw on anything but a Char is severly frowned upon. Then there is the whole white heifer breeding disease rumor that doesnt help white shorthorn bulls either. False or not, its out there.

 

[NHR]

Well we purchased a solid white bull this year because of his genetics and all my buyers want whites and roans and all I have is mainly red cows with red calves this year. I could sell every roan that hits the ground. We did have one roan this year sired by Jake's Proud Jazz.

Must be wrong because the roan calves sell for more money down here....

 

[kfacres]

Well we purchased a solid white bull this year because of his genetics and all my buyers want whites and roans and all I have is mainly red cows with red calves this year. I could sell every roan that hits the ground. We did have one roan this year sired by Jake's Proud Jazz.

Must be wrong because the roan calves sell for more money down here....

maybe in a show calf market?  but in the "real" world...  take a roaner to the marketplace.. and you leave buck naked, and walking home.  They'll take your clothes, truck, trailor... and more so than not- they'll still send you a bill on the calf you just tried to sell!?

anyone disagree? 

Color is a showring fad, far more so than not.  I guess good cattle are good cattle.. but the United Reducers boys sure don't agree.