County Show = Popularity Contest

[green8911]

Just finished our county show.  Makes the top 3 of the most frustrating experiences I've ever been involved with.  No separate breed classes so anyone with an American was pretty much eliminated before they got there.  Lo and behold, top 3 were exotic.  We are fortunate to have a premium sale but that's where popularity came in.  Top American brought less than any calf there as the kid with him was a newcomer.  Co-op calves brought more than him.  Feel really bad for the kid and future of this county's youth interest because of this type of stuff.  Im new to this stuff and an educator in the area as well as a single parent.  Are all county show's like this?  Is my child required to participate in their county show?  Sorry for the ignorant questions but my husband (now ex-husband) was very active with my son in this stuff and now Im taking it over in the middle.  Just don't like parading my child in front of a bunch a people with a show calf that got reserve in his class, got great compliments from the judges, and in the sale, brought less than the very dead last place cow.  Popularity contest, and he lost.

 

[cowman 52]

This has happened since Ugh haltered  his first dinosaur.  There are 2 ways to fix it IF you can get the sales committee to buy on.  first is sales committee keeps a reserve to bring lower performing bids up to a reasonable average.  It took years but it finally got done here. Second is auctioneer just hammer the lot sold before it gets past reasonable.  Bidders can add to the bid but the ring bid stays reasonable. Show here takes a commission for just such a problem and it took a while but now there are not the 20 th place pig out selling the champion steer.

 

[cowman 52]

Don't let the county deal ruin your outlook on showing.  These deals are as we would say  " a goat roping". And will pretty much stay that way.  Once saw the champion heifer at Houston stand 23 once, so just don't get too out of shape.  Do have words with your sale committee people,  if they work 3 to 5 min to get the bid up on one they need to work just as hard on  The rest.  Money is tight but you still are working for all the kids in the county, not just a few.

 

[knabe]

Also contact local businesses to bid on calves

That probably teaches kids more about business than the combing a calf for weeks.

When i was in college, i sold two people's calves on our team in addition to mine. That taught me a lot.

 

[chambero]

You have to remember - nobody owes your kid money.  It is all donations.  Step back and think - is it right to gripe because someone didnt donate enough to you.  People that bid at county fairs dont care or know a thing about calves - they are bidding on kids.  And yes it is a popularity contest - the more people that know you thru business, community activities, church, etc the more money you are likely to get.  If you are in this for money, you are in it for the wrong reason.

 

[simba]

You have to remember - nobody owes your kid money.  It is all donations.  Step back and think - is it right to gripe because someone didnt donate enough to you.  People that bid at county fairs dont care or know a thing about calves - they are bidding on kids.  And yes it is a popularity contest - the more people that know you thru business, community activities, church, etc the more money you are likely to get.  If you are in this for money, you are in it for the wrong reason.

I totally agree. I still remember my second year in 4-H where I had reserve champion steer and still had the lowest price of our whole sale. I was crying because I had worked so hard and got $0.20 - $4.00 per pound less than all the other kids. My mom explained to me that the buyers who bought most of the other kid's calves were fertilizer, feed and machinery companies. Because my family doesn't farm, those companies never once did bid on any of my calves. It was a tough lesson to learn and I consistently always had one of the lower selling steers, but I did it for 10 years because of the fact that I loved raising the animals and the money I did make could be put toward my purbred females. 

It is a popularity contest, always will be. The only year I made good money was when a neighbour's construction company bought my steer. Talk to friends/neighbours/relatives and help them find someone to slpit the beef with if that's their issue. Good luck! 

 

[Kevin A]

I wouldn't say its just a popularity contest, speaking from personal experience and not sure if this is the case with your show but growing up, our animals always sold well because its a way for the co-op, elevator, and chemical companies to say thank you for doing business with them. If your family spends tens of thousands of dollars on services and the next kids family lives in town or just isn't farming, their animal probably wont bring as much. Just my 2 cents.

 

[GoWyo]

Next year, obtain a list of the previous buyers and look for who you do any kind of business with.  We make a point to remind the businesses we do even occasional business with that a big reason we do business with them is because of their support of the junior livestock sale at county fair.  Make buyer visits a couple of weeks before county fair to let them know you have a steer and that you work hard with your animals and let them know you appreciate their past support and hope that they will bid on your animal.  Recruit new buyers in to the sale.  They can bid on less expensive animals like a pen of chickens or a lamb or hog.  Having new buyers supporting the sale brings up the entire sale a certain percentage.  If you have a business or work for a business, get to the sale and bid on animals.  Our newspaper publishes a whole page ad before the sale and another ad after the sale naming the buyers of the champion animals and listing all of the buyers.  This is good advertising.  You have to let your buyers know that you appreciate them all year long because anything they pay over market price is a pure donation to your kid.  You have to give them a reason to want to make that donation.

 

[green8911]

I understand what you're saying and I understand that no-one "owes" my kid anything.  But just sit back for a minute and think about what you're saying and doing here.  I.E., step outside of the show world and put yourself in the position of 90% of the rest of the families out here who are NOT involved to the degree you're speaking of, not because we don't want to be, but because we are not here to be involved.  Example, I'm new to the area we live in, I get home at 7 every night and my job requires me to travel 2 weeks out every month (13 days on the road).  My ex-husband lives in another state and I'm the sole keeper of my son.  I'm a parent who relies on our schools ag dept teachers and 4H agent to do the right thing to make sure my kid, like all the others, gets a fair shake.  By the comments you're making, what you're saying is that people like me who aren't the "popular" known people in the community, who aren't "involved", etc., shouldn't even bother getting our kids involved in this show BS only because it's going to put them up on a pedestal in front of a bunch of people who have no idea who they are, really don't care who they are, and since they don't "owe" my kid anything, really could care less how unfair the whole deal is.  So basically this is a "social" beauty pageant for the cattle people.  And to go a step further, all year long the messages about "we want to get more kids involved" and "we need to get more kids in the programs to build these programs and keep this ag culture alive", is really a 100% complete line of absolute BS.  Because if the outcome is that the people in the community are only going to "bid up" the popular family names, then really the only reason they're "baiting" no-name kids into the whole mess is to keep the show itself alive so they have enough participation to even have a show in the first place for their "popular" named kids to attend.  What a crock of ...............

 

[JSchroeder]

It's your fault.

I guarantee it.

Few things are more certain than the fact that the parent venting that their kid didn’t get enough money wasn’t one of the parents out there raising the money in the first place.

It's pretty simple actually, you don't even have to do business with the companies that donate their money.

If you want your kid to get more money in the show stop bitching about it, pull up your bootstraps, and start raising money for next year.  Not only your kid but every kid.  I guarantee that if you do that, your kid will be taken care of next year.

Or anonymously gripe about it on the internet.

Whichever you think works best.

 

[green8911]

Wow.  You're still completely missing the point.  P O P U L A R I T Y  C O N T E S T.  I still ask the begging question.  Why beg and market and say "we need more kids to participate", "we need more kids in the program", when the people making these statements know very well that they really only need that "participation" to get the numbers up to keep the show alive so their own "popular" kids will have a show to attend.  These "known" named kids are the ones who have the moms and dads who work in the local businesses, who are in the local governments, are "connected" to the local business world, etc.  90% of the rest of us, the real people, the ones they solicit for participation, are not "connected" because we do not work local, are not from the area, and are so far stretched as it is with both time and money we are doing absolutely everything we can for our kids as it is to just pay for feed and make it home in time to kiss them goodnight.  Like it or not, that's reality.

 

[RyanChandler]

Life = popularity contest. 

 

[green8911]

Yes, to an extent.  But you know, that doesn't mean I have to go down without a fight.  I'm seeing the biggest way to fight this going forward is to combat this BS marketing scam by those running this county show by being the vocal opponent to getting kids involved based on exactly what this conversation here is saying.  Low participation takes away from these "popularity contests" and dilutes it completely.  Make it fair, or make it go away.  And with todays social media power, I'll gladly lead that effort.

 

[Kevin A]

Cant the fact that your son gets to be around animals, stay out of trouble, and make a couple bucks be enough? So what if he didn't make a killing. I wouldn't trade my years in 4-H/FFA for anything, I would have paid them to be in it! People really need to stop looking for everything to be fair and be given their "due". Enjoy life and be thankful for what you have.

 

[chambero]

You are basically saying that whoever bought your kids calf didn't do enough.  The money you get at a county fair is about last in the line of benefits a kid gets from being involved in ag and showing cattle.

Since you obviously dont have a clue about how a county show works, first of all your ag teacher/county agent has nothing to do with prices at a county sale.  That is almost always handled by a committee of business people/old parents who work their butts off all year to raise money.  I'm guessing you are in Tx because its that time of year.  There's a good chance that unbeknownst to you, your fair has an add-on or levelling program that will make sure all animals bring a certain amount.

Go ahead and pull your kid out of ag/4-H.  Your ag teacher/agent will be thankful - one less ungrateful ass-whip parent to deal with.

There is a book worth writing by collecting stories from ag teachers/agents on the goings on at county shows.  Whether its judging, auctions, etc it never ceases to amaze me how so many people can go something that is so inherently good and come away mad.

The only real reason to respond to a post like this is to help everyone and ourselves remember to be grateful for the volunteer financial support that is so great nationwide for this program.  Your feeling the morning after a sale should be nothing but gratitude.  If its not, you have "issues".

 

[Limiman12]

Green8911......



I am a business owner that has a livestock addiction on the side.  First and foremost I am a business owner.  I support two county fairs.  The night before the sale, I try to get my hands on a sale bill to go through the list of kids selling animals.  Yes I said kids, not the list of animals, the animals are all the same in my eyes when I am bidding, the kid is what is different.  As I go through the list with a hi lighter and hi light the KIDS name who is a patient, or whose family members are patients.  Then I go though the list with my mom, who does my bidding while I am at work, and "rank" them and give her my total budget.    The whole family comes in, going to bid it higher.  One family member comes in, going to make sure it goes fair.  I have had Granpas come to me and ask if I would buy their grand kids calf, and that if I agreed to bid it up higher then my budget they would split the cost with me.  I have also bid on calves for kids that through the years went above an beyond to help my kids or be nice to my kids, or sometimes kids that I know through other community projects they are involved in.  Names of kids I recognize get hi lited, if there is money left in my budget when it gets to the end of the sale, mom will make sue that kids from my former club and school get a fair price.

Last year for instance, I bid on a girls red ribbon steer.  She was a wrestling cheerleader, and for four years when I took my daughter to wrestling tournaments the wrestling cheerleaders let her sit with them, and they played with her and anytime I tried to get her to sit with me, the cheerleaders, this girl in particular, insisted that they loved her being with them.....  I started bidding, so did the banker that her family did business with, so did the Hy Vee manager where she has a part time job, so did her cheerleader coach, so did her grandpa......  She ended up getting more then the res champions steer.  It was her last time through the sale ring, she was/is a girl that bends over backwards to help anyone she can, and yes the are a lot of people that know her because of everything she is involved in.

Yes it sucks for first time kids without a lot of connections, but as a bidder at such a sale, it is a "donation" as a way to say thanks for doing business with me, or thanks for being such a good kid.  Don't give up and don't ***** about it.  Look at it this way, you are new to a job, do you start at the companies top pay grade?  No, you start at a starting wage and as you work at it, learn more gain experience you get raises.  Your kid started at minimum wage at the sale this year, if he works hard, is active in school and community and impresses people for the right reasons, in time his name will be hi lighted on a lot of sale bills.

 

[cebwtx]

I am quite sure that my daughter showed a heifer at the same show you are talking about. If so yes there are well known names that show here. That being said I watched all of the steer show and a better part Of the heifer show. The show itself I didn't feel was to bad of a popularity contest. When a limousine takes grand and a beef master takes reserve in heifers and desrevably so in my mind you can bet it wasn't all popularity. The auction at this show is different though. You can see it how you want to. I don't know the exact details but I believe the show has a minimum for grand and reserve. I know the ag mechanics get get at least a grand for overall champ. It is made clear up front to our kids that if you make sale you are responsible to have a buyer, if you don't then your expected to pull from the sale. The reason is if you don't there are very few risidule buyers and you end up with the result as you are speaking of. I've been around this show for 25 years and at one point it was after the majors and was a terminal show but has turned to a premium show. There is crazy competition at this county show, major show grand champions have shown here so it is what it is. I thought the judge overall was pretty good. As for the american champion, he called it a ft worth deluxe and I agree. Don't feel to bad for that one because if mothing goes crazy it will make plenty of money at their sale. All being said yes there is always the popularity effect but the auction, At least in our chapter is explained to be who can one bust there butt and find buyers or those who have family with good charitable connections.

 

[BTDT]

Green8911 - as a parent and educator you, above any one else, should understand and realize that every single thing you do in life is a  POPULARITY CONTEST; a job, a competition, any buy/sell situation, education, ANY THING.  Once you understand that, you will be happier. Seems like this is a parent issue and not a youth issue. 
Yes, sometimes your feelings get hurt, and sometimes you do not get what you think you deserve, and sometimes you do not get what you actually deserve, but, that is life.

Livestock shows should not be a political contest or a popularity contest, but it is, because it is part of life.  So treat it as life.  Before the fair, have your child hand deliver invitations to both the show and the sale.  Shake hands, smile.  After the sale, get a list of buyers and send them thank you notes even if they didn't purchase your animal.  Buy your feed from the local mill and remind them of that fact.  I will be honest, while growing up, I did all of those things and the feed dealer never attended the sale or supported the fair at all. So, I sent them a letter stating I was switching my business to another dealer who did support the fair (not just me, but the youth in general).  It took exactly ONE YEAR for that dealer to attend the sale and purchase some animals.

Your point is well taken about it gets hard to get youth to participate in such a popularity contest.  It is especially hard to get the youth to participate in activities where the ADULTS are whining, complaining and throwing fits about the activity instead of working to make it better.  Once again, it is proven that a majority of the problem with the youth activities is the adults.


I saw a shirt at the FFA convention that said "It is 5:30 am, do you know where YOUR child is?"  And it had a picture of a barn and pitchfork.  Take the all the positives of the 4-H and FFA program and either change or live with the "problems". 

 

[hntwhitetail]

Green8911......



I am a business owner that has a livestock addiction on the side.  First and foremost I am a business owner.  I support two county fairs.  The night before the sale, I try to get my hands on a sale bill to go through the list of kids selling animals.  Yes I said kids, not the list of animals, the animals are all the same in my eyes when I am bidding, the kid is what is different.  As I go through the list with a hi lighter and hi light the KIDS name who is a patient, or whose family members are patients.  Then I go though the list with my mom, who does my bidding while I am at work, and "rank" them and give her my total budget.    The whole family comes in, going to bid it higher.  One family member comes in, going to make sure it goes fair.  I have had Granpas come to me and ask if I would buy their grand kids calf, and that if I agreed to bid it up higher then my budget they would split the cost with me.  I have also bid on calves for kids that through the years went above an beyond to help my kids or be nice to my kids, or sometimes kids that I know through other community projects they are involved in.  Names of kids I recognize get hi lited, if there is money left in my budget when it gets to the end of the sale, mom will make sue that kids from my former club and school get a fair price.

Last year for instance, I bid on a girls red ribbon steer.  She was a wrestling cheerleader, and for four years when I took my daughter to wrestling tournaments the wrestling cheerleaders let her sit with them, and they played with her and anytime I tried to get her to sit with me, the cheerleaders, this girl in particular, insisted that they loved her being with them.....  I started bidding, so did the banker that her family did business with, so did the Hy Vee manager where she has a part time job, so did her cheerleader coach, so did her grandpa......  She ended up getting more then the res champions steer.  It was her last time through the sale ring, she was/is a girl that bends over backwards to help anyone she can, and yes the are a lot of people that know her because of everything she is involved in.

Yes it sucks for first time kids without a lot of connections, but as a bidder at such a sale, it is a "donation" as a way to say thanks for doing business with me, or thanks for being such a good kid.  Don't give up and don't ***** about it.  Look at it this way, you are new to a job, do you start at the companies top pay grade?  No, you start at a starting wage and as you work at it, learn more gain experience you get raises.  Your kid started at minimum wage at the sale this year, if he works hard, is active in school and community and impresses people for the right reasons, in time his name will be hi lighted on a lot of sale bills.

Very well said.

 

[chambero]

Ditto