Starting a new Shorthorn Association for Cattle Breeders

[knabe]

I see a major problem with this bull. Color! I have read on here over the years that only the Red shorthorns are viable for commercial. This bull looks like he belongs in the show ring. Just saying!!!

do you have any red leroy daughters?

 

[NHR]

1. If someone wants this changed then it needs to be brought up to the board and membership to drive it to fruition, however I believe the data would not be accurate because some would just "eyeball weigh" the animal. With EPD's there is an accuracy. The Accuracy should be the guide for breeding determinations along with actually looking at reported BW's of progeny. This topic does not really matter to me, I could go either way.

Without actuals EPDS HAVE ZERO ACCURACY!!! What do you think the epds are based off? How do you think the EPDS become adjusted?  You're logic is comparable to saying there should be no rules bc we know some people will break them.  Hell, I'd even take an eyeball weight over looking at a set of EPDS that reflect an individual 5 generations back.

Duh! I guess reading comprehension does not apply here. Choose only bulls that have high accuracy EPD's for your breeding program!!! Also nothing is stopping a breeder from collecting their own data beyond what the association enables. For instance Waukaru....

Quit complaining and create your market!

 

[NHR]

I see a major problem with this bull. Color! I have read on here over the years that only the Red shorthorns are viable for commercial. This bull looks like he belongs in the show ring. Just saying!!!

do you have any red leroy daughters?

Nope, All of mine are those nasty old red Trump bred cows that are easy fleshing, easy keeping, docile, fertile, and raise heavy weaning calves....

 

[RyanChandler]

I see a major problem with this bull. Color! I have read on here over the years that only the Red shorthorns are viable for commercial. This bull looks like he belongs in the show ring. Just saying!!!

do you have any red leroy daughters?

Nope, All of mine are those nasty old red Trump bred cows that are easy fleshing, easy keeping, docile, fertile, and raise heavy weaning calves....

They may be docile and when you're not gorging them- fertile, but a quick glance on your website at their phenotype pre-full feed is all I need to conclude the rest.. is well,, just fabricated. 

 

[RyanChandler]

1. If someone wants this changed then it needs to be brought up to the board and membership to drive it to fruition, however I believe the data would not be accurate because some would just "eyeball weigh" the animal. With EPD's there is an accuracy. The Accuracy should be the guide for breeding determinations along with actually looking at reported BW's of progeny. This topic does not really matter to me, I could go either way.

Without actuals EPDS HAVE ZERO ACCURACY!!! What do you think the epds are based off? How do you think the EPDS become adjusted?  You're logic is comparable to saying there should be no rules bc we know some people will break them.  Hell, I'd even take an eyeball weight over looking at a set of EPDS that reflect an individual 5 generations back.

Duh! I guess reading comprehension does not apply here. Choose only bulls that have high accuracy EPD's for your breeding program!!! Also nothing is stopping a breeder from collecting their own data beyond what the association enables. For instance Waukaru....

Quit complaining and create your market!

I also find it sad your interest in the Shorthorn breed only extends as far as your property line.  The mandatory reporting initiatives I propose are grounded in so much more.  Today, Shorthorn breeders have a chance to establish standards, a chance to go forth unfettered by the past and build a breed which is as nearly ideal for its purpose as we can make it.  It is my goal to build the breed that will endure all, that will command the respect of others, and that will quicken the pride of future Shorthorn breeders. 

 

[Bradenh]

The reason you don't see legitimacy in sanctioned shows is because you cant and won't ever have the cattle it takes to compete in one, I didn't say win I said compete, it's easier to support as long as your claim is only valid with unsanctioned roots. Kinda make it up as you go, like a make believe land, or a make believe victory because we all know you'd never really beat anyone

World champion is a vauge term and it's even more vauge when it's self proclaimed much like alot of your marketing theorys (pop)

Easy to say your superior when your cattle never get exposure to the world past your property line head to head with what the "people's choice" calls superior

 

[NHR]

I see a major problem with this bull. Color! I have read on here over the years that only the Red shorthorns are viable for commercial. This bull looks like he belongs in the show ring. Just saying!!!

do you have any red leroy daughters?

Nope, All of mine are those nasty old red Trump bred cows that are easy fleshing, easy keeping, docile, fertile, and raise heavy weaning calves....

They may be docile and when you're not gorging them- fertile, but a quick glance on your website at their phenotype pre-full feed is all I need to conclude the rest.. is well,, just fabricated.

Wow you judge my feeding program without knowing what it is. That is the problem with people today. The photo you posted is of a 6 month that had been weaned for 3 weeks and a very bad photographer (by the way she was named Reserve Champion at the show). The heifer in the photo was never fed more then 12lbs of feed per day her entire life and was bred AI at 14 months of age with 1 straw of semen. So your input is baseless.

 

[Bradenh]

We needed a new angle so I think this one is optimal to promote the bull

Easy fleshing, deep girth, ideal dewlap attachment, world champion quality

Heck too good to go show for crying out loud

 

[NHR]

I see a major problem with this bull. Color! I have read on here over the years that only the Red shorthorns are viable for commercial. This bull looks like he belongs in the show ring. Just saying!!!

do you have any red leroy daughters?

Nope, All of mine are those nasty old red Trump bred cows that are easy fleshing, easy keeping, docile, fertile, and raise heavy weaning calves....

They may be docile and when you're not gorging them- fertile, but a quick glance on your website at their phenotype pre-full feed is all I need to conclude the rest.. is well,, just fabricated.

Wow you judge my feeding program without knowing what it is. That is the problem with people today. The photo you posted is of a 6 month that had been weaned for 3 weeks and a very bad photographer (by the way she was named Reserve Champion at the show). The heifer in the photo was never fed more then 12lbs of feed per day her entire life and was bred AI at 14 months of age with 1 straw of semen. So your input is baseless.

Here is the dam of the heifer. She was never fed more then 10lbs feed per day and would put on weight by seeing a hay trailer pass by. She was always described as the most complete female at the show. We even had Angus breeders commenting on how good she is and several of them would like to have a pasture full of cows like her. She is in the pasture producing the kind we like and is in optimal condition on grass and range mineral. She has been flushed 3 times and resulted in 36 frozen embryos, 31 frozen embryos, and 22 frozen embryos. Yes, we keep full records here and know exactly what each animal has been given and exactly how they perform.

 

[RyanChandler]

NHR,

'Feeding program"- I can conclude -not judge- all I need to by your boasting of 'only' 12 lbs a day and taking at 14 months... That's 12lbs/day more than Ive ever fed one of my heifers and I'd be alarmed if, at 14 months, they hadn't cycled 5 or 6 times by then so I'm really not sure what type of milestone you're trying to set there.  You have some nice 'looking' cows, no doubt. But until, you stop bringing the feed bucket to them in the barn, you have no idea what you have.  WHR is right down the road. I see exactly what it takes to keep those genetics looking and performing the way they do.  Who knows though, maybe all he keeps are the hard doing ones.  :


And Mr FFA,  Until show judges start implementing a selection protocol based on functional beef cattle characteristics, I don't see any reason to give up my Saturday work days at the farm or my Sunday fundays at the lake to parade around with some snotty nosed kid like yourself.  Again, as long as you mistake intervention for genetic superiority, your input with me is mute.

 

[NHR]

NHR,

'Feeding program"- I can conclude -not judge- all I need to by your boasting of 'only' 12 lbs a day and taking at 14 months... That's 12lbs/day more than Ive ever fed one of my heifers and I'd be alarmed if, at 14 months, they hadn't cycled 5 or 6 times by then so I'm really not sure what type of milestone you're trying to set there.  You have some nice 'looking' cows, no doubt. But until, you stop bringing the feed bucket to them in the barn, you have no idea what you have.  WHR is right down the road. I see exactly what it takes to keep those genetics looking and performing the way they do.  Who knows though, maybe all he keeps are the hard doing ones.  :

So you still judge someones program without facts! We also raise replacements and they are on a grass based system and outperform the cows on your facebook page! See I can be snotty and judgmental also without actually seeing your cattle in person. You should be real careful how and what you saw about someones operation without even seeing the operation!!!!

This is why I dont post much on this site because of uninformed folks like you Xbar.

I never said the 14 months was the first heat cycle. Gosh some people are just so ignorant.

 

[RyanChandler]

My name is Ryan Chandler. You can address me as so if you like.  My FB is public for a reason, I have nothing to hide- though I will publicly question your claim of 'outperforming.' --ESPECIALLY if you're talking about the same genetics as you show. Additionally, I'd like to see exactly what it is that I said/judged that misrepresented you or 'your program.'  And bc apparently I missed it, what was the point of bringing a '14 month old heifer sticking on the first time' into the equation then?

And as far as the pic of -V- posted. I can't help the fact that he came off the trailer unable to walk with severe foot rot. I think it's understandable that a bull whose sole source of acquiring nutrition is through grazing might appear gaunt under these circumstances.

Here's a pic that more accurately depicts his condition when he's able to graze and comfortably make his way to a water source. Outside of a little more sheath than I'd prefer, you'd be hard pressed to pick a hole in him.

 

[NHR]

My name is Ryan Chandler. You can address me as so if you like.  My FB is public for a reason, I have nothing to hide- though I will publicly question your claim of 'outperforming.' --ESPECIALLY if you're talking about the same genetics as you show. Additionally, I'd like to see exactly what it is that I said/judged that misrepresented you or 'your program.'  And bc apparently I missed it, what was the point of bringing a '14 month old heifer sticking on the first time' into the equation then?

So in this quote you say I fabricate (cheat, makeup, lie)

"They may be docile and when you're not gorging them- fertile, but a quick glance on your website at their phenotype pre-full feed is all I need to conclude the rest.. is well,, just fabricated."

I rest my case!

And yes my genetics I show are the same genetics that perform in the pasture. Just because I have some Trump in my cattle does not make them non performers. Last I recalled in genetics 101 is that the dam provides a lot of input to the performance of the cattle also, not just the bull. And without seeing my cattle in person and stating that my cattle are worthless is judging them and flat out calling me a liar!!!

 

[Bradenh]

It's "daddy FFA" to you mrs chandler

Keep denying what we all know you get on a show forum and say you have world champions when you choose to sit at home and not show the world your cattle are inferior phenotypically

Only reason any sensible person would be like you

Either lets start seeing some phenotypical merit from your calves, or stop critiquing others, if your going to chirp on show cattle forums

Why don't you chirp alittle bit with someone on the end of a halter with your cattle in the ring

You can't because your world champ crown would be stolen before you drove up

Last time I checked commercial cattlemen in your real world didn't care about the token of world champion, you must have something to prove to the club calf boys

And stay at the lake as far as I'm concerned, because it will be the snot nosed kids like myself that wil laugh you out of town

 

[aj]

The color of the bull is a issue. IF you decide to go red only......no markings......you are 3 generations from getting there. I've been down that road.

 

[bart]

Going to have to pop another batch on this one. (pop) Xbar please tell me how great you cattle? He seems to have plenty of ground clearance to get around in the rough county?

 

[NHR]

Going to have to pop another batch on this one. (pop) Xbar please tell me how great you cattle? He seems to have plenty of ground clearance to get around in the rough county?

(clapping) (clapping) (clapping) (clapping) (pop) (clapping) (clapping) (clapping) (clapping)

 

[Bradenh]

They're fantastic Bart- far too good to show they are strictly commercial even though he likes to promote them on show cattle pages, because he knows the real world boys would make fun of him

It's hard to screw up from that angle view

But id sure change his heart girth, don't y'all know that is the "lid of the barrel?" Quoting an old wanna be cattleman there

 

[knabe]

Outside of a little more sheath than I'd prefer, you'd be hard pressed to pick a hole in him.

Why did you point one of them towards the lens?

 

[Bradenh]

With an ugly nasty dong like that I'd like to put him on some maines and see if he couldn't throw me an abc

Better be a good Maine- I don't think ol boy could throw one stout enough to compete even in the Americans unless you bred him Belgian blue