knabe
Well-known member
yuppiecowboy said:
it should feel no different to sell the "exceptional" animal as it is to get rid of the opposite extreme.
Finding semen on old bulls
- Thread starter Endless Meadows
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it should feel no different to sell the "exceptional" animal as it is to get rid of the opposite extreme.
aj
Well-known member
I always thought the Guiness bull was kinda old school type(frame wise). I'm not sure if he ended up being th or not. He was horned though. What was the story on the old G-9 bull? Was he supposed to be part maine? Didn't he win a big show?. What would the analysi of the Duke Of Dublin bull be? He was horned to I think. One thing about the Hubs cattle was that they had big ole testicles and they could cover cows. We had the Hubs Impact bull. He serviced 60 cows that first year. Impact 1 not 2.
aj, talk to Harry Krug about the Duke of Dublin bull. He used the tar out of a son called TNT Duke 6R, and had a pile of daughters. Twig and I looked at his cows in the early 80's when everyone was on the tall/narrow/bad rant. Harry's cows were very uniform, moderate framed, beefy animals. I would like to find some IDS Duke of Dublin semen if it is still around. Even though they are longer gestation (from what I have heard/read) I would still like to use some.
justintime
Well-known member
M Bar... I have lots of Duke of Dublin semen stored with Wayne Temple in ILL. There must be over be over 600 doses there yet. He is TH free. Guinness was also TH free.
Harry Krug was one of Duke's biggest fans. He used two or three sons of Duke with TNT Duke 6R being the last one... and he used him for many years. Harry used a Duke son he got from me, and then sold him to JC Scritchfield. He was out of Scotsmorr Raggedy Ann 4H, and Harry used to phone me every spring and see what she had for a calf. 5 years in a row, Harry purchased her calf, regardless if it was a bull or heifer calf. Each year the deal was the same. I was to deliver the calf to the Polled Congress in Omaha.
Harry used to come up here often and visit. I remember one trip where Harry had been up to one of our production sales. After the sale, he headed for Kansas, and he decided to go straight south of our farm to a port that is only open until 9PM. When he got to the port, it was closed and there were some barricades across the road. He sat there for a few minutes and decided that seeing there was no one around, that he would just move the barricade and drive through. He did this successfully, and drove home to Kansas. When he pulled into his farm, the state trooper was sitting there. He greeted Harry with " Harry, we expected you to arrive 4 hours ago.... Where have you been?" I think it cost him a fair bit of money when the court case was over.
Harry Krug was one of Duke's biggest fans. He used two or three sons of Duke with TNT Duke 6R being the last one... and he used him for many years. Harry used a Duke son he got from me, and then sold him to JC Scritchfield. He was out of Scotsmorr Raggedy Ann 4H, and Harry used to phone me every spring and see what she had for a calf. 5 years in a row, Harry purchased her calf, regardless if it was a bull or heifer calf. Each year the deal was the same. I was to deliver the calf to the Polled Congress in Omaha.
Harry used to come up here often and visit. I remember one trip where Harry had been up to one of our production sales. After the sale, he headed for Kansas, and he decided to go straight south of our farm to a port that is only open until 9PM. When he got to the port, it was closed and there were some barricades across the road. He sat there for a few minutes and decided that seeing there was no one around, that he would just move the barricade and drive through. He did this successfully, and drove home to Kansas. When he pulled into his farm, the state trooper was sitting there. He greeted Harry with " Harry, we expected you to arrive 4 hours ago.... Where have you been?" I think it cost him a fair bit of money when the court case was over.
Endless Meadows
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I do already have 20 units of Guinness and 16 of one of his son's BBS Hope's Prime Time along with 1 straw of IDS Duke of Dublin. In the same package also came 30 units of Woodland Improver. Does anyone know his TH status? I could not find it on any lists. Thanks
justintime
Well-known member
Guinness and Prime Time are both TH free. I am not sure about Woodland Improver. He was an ET son of Deerpark Improver and his dam was a full Irish cow as well. I had a real good daughter from him that came from Ward Bakenhus ( ARSULU). She was TH free but that doesn't prove anything about the sire. I would suggest that you call Ward and see if he knows his TH status, before you use any of the semen. If anyone know, Ward would , as he was a herdsire there.
My recollection of Guiness was that he was pretty big in size and a little coarse shouldered. Some of the calves I saw out of him seemed to dip behind the shoulder. I only had a few calves out of him and they were okay. I have heard others say he sired some good producing females. I would not be afraid to use Duke of Dublin. He's in the pedigree of a lot of good cattle. I have been told his daughters are not the best milkers, but have no personal experience since we sold the only heifer calves we got out of him. Perhaps someone else can offer more insight. G-9 impressed me more than any other in his day.
Endless Meadows
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These might seem like dumb questions but what bull is G-9? There have also been a few people that mentioned the Hub's Ranch bulls. Are they still raising Shorthorns? How available is semen on some of the old Hub's bulls?
Virgil passed away a few years ago but Steve is still running the cow herd. They are still going strong and sticking to the same breeding philosophy they have had for decades. Call Steve he would have as good of idea as anyone on what is available.
aj
Well-known member
Hubs had a bull called buttercup prince and a bull called dominator(I think). They had semen on both years ago. There were probably 5 years or so in there they had the hottest cattle in the U.S.. Mckee and Stout and some other breeders discovered them and the secret was out. The cattle had additional frame yet were fairly thick and practical as I remember them. We bought a bull called Hubs Impact from them and we used Buttercup Prince a little A.I.. I believe Don Stout was one of the first to find this herd. Virgil told me that Don came up to look at heifer calves. The story was that Don looked at the calves all day long and about the time the sun went down Don picked out a heifer named Valeria I think. She ended up being one of Dons best cow families I believe and left many offspring in the herd. I thought it was cool as they were finding diamonds in the rough like that.
G-9 was Mill Brook Ransom G-9 and Kenmar Ransom 32Z was listed as his sire if memory serves correctly. R. Lee Johnson in Ohio showed him and later sold him to Sutherland Farms in Kentucky. We heard many rumors on the show road about G-9 really being out of Cunia or Capone, but didn't really pay a lot of attention at the time because somebody is always trying to find an imperfection in the winner. G-9 was mostly red in color with some white markings on his side. I believe Hubs Dominant was my favorite of the Hubs bulls. Hubs Impact Two did a pretty good job for Merle Welch, too. Virgil Wegener and Steve Washburn were two of the nice folks we got to know traveling around. Their cattle were very competitive, maybe just a little behind the Graham cattle in the show ring.
r.n.reed
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Spring Canyon Prince and Defenders Promise or Challenge are high on my wish list.
aj
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I just noticed JDS Fireman was sired by Powerplant?
aj
Well-known member
Wasn't there a 2975 or something like that out of G-9.
Doc
Well-known member
aj said:
Yea, he was pretty popular for a while. The bad thing was most of his daughters' udders would be shot by the time they were 7 or 8.We showed a son of him for Spring Place Shorthorns back in '83 I think, that was Res. Grand at Kansas City & calf champ. at L'ville. Time Share tried to buy semen rights on him at KC for $48,000.00, but SPS said he would have to give too much to Uncle Sam so he wouldn't do it. He took him back to Georgia & you never heard anything out of him again.
justintime
Well-known member
Ah....... the good old days!!
aj
Well-known member
Okay,okay,okay,OMG! How about "the great white hope"? Was he a abs bull?
We tied beside White Hope at state fair--he was a good looking critter that sure ate a lot of feed. Don't remember if he was with ABS. We had one Columbus daughter that I liked.
G-9 sired cattle that were easy to look at. We used Ransom 256, and that was one of Dad's favorite bulls of all time. Waukaru used 179 and there were several other influential G-9 sons. Milk EPD was a weakness with some of those cattle. Our 256 bull sired clean fronts and very little waste at the pins, something Shorthorns needed to clean up at that time.
G-9 sired cattle that were easy to look at. We used Ransom 256, and that was one of Dad's favorite bulls of all time. Waukaru used 179 and there were several other influential G-9 sons. Milk EPD was a weakness with some of those cattle. Our 256 bull sired clean fronts and very little waste at the pins, something Shorthorns needed to clean up at that time.
Doc
Well-known member
I always liked 179 dtrs. One son that G9 sired that did some good was CC Cujo. Who in turn sired Pa Do Boxer, past Nat'l Champ & IMO a true bull that deserved to be Champ & could sure stride on out in the ring.
justintime
Well-known member
I still have Great White Hope in one of my tanks. Yes he was marketed by ABS. He did a nice job of cleaning up some of the cattle of the time, but I don't think his offspring would have enough natural muscling for today.
In regards to the 2975 line, I liked Marc 1V about as good as any of the 2975 sons. He was out of a great cow named Millbrook Nita 73 who was sired by Kinnaber Leader 6th and a dam that was bred in the Chris Thomas herd in Manitoba. Marc 1V was mainly known for his daughters, which were excellent easy fleshing, thick made females. I used a son of Marc 1V named CCS Marc Drive who did a very good job for us. We leased him to ABS and he was marketed around the world for a few years. Some of our donors are descendents of his, including a daughter and a grand daughter.
In my list of top 10 cows I have seen, I have a daughter of Marc1V named CCS Marc Scarlet 930S in it. She was out of Deerpark Scarlet 18th, who was the first Shorthorn female to be syndicated at $25,000. She was a Guinness daughter and one of the better Irish females to be imported.
In regards to the 2975 line, I liked Marc 1V about as good as any of the 2975 sons. He was out of a great cow named Millbrook Nita 73 who was sired by Kinnaber Leader 6th and a dam that was bred in the Chris Thomas herd in Manitoba. Marc 1V was mainly known for his daughters, which were excellent easy fleshing, thick made females. I used a son of Marc 1V named CCS Marc Drive who did a very good job for us. We leased him to ABS and he was marketed around the world for a few years. Some of our donors are descendents of his, including a daughter and a grand daughter.
In my list of top 10 cows I have seen, I have a daughter of Marc1V named CCS Marc Scarlet 930S in it. She was out of Deerpark Scarlet 18th, who was the first Shorthorn female to be syndicated at $25,000. She was a Guinness daughter and one of the better Irish females to be imported.
